Oh god OH MY GOD. For those of us who will either be watching the actual BBC airing of the mid-season finale or, like me, illegally viewing such things because I WILL NOT BE FORCED TO WAIT FOR THIS SHIT, the last liveblog of Doctor Who for quite some time is about to take place. And let us all enjoy the moment our heads collectively explode.
omg i love that i can say this: YOU ARE NOT PREPARED. Well, obviously, I am not either, BUT STILL.
No spoilery images or hints from me today. Let’s all respect that for each other, ok? Especially those in America who must wait a week.
This liveblog starts relative to you. So if it is airing on your television, start liveblogging away in the comments. Same for if you happen to be watching it online by less-than-legal means. (Though I would just time it with another time zone so you can comment with other people!) We already do this with Fringe and it works rather nicely. To avoid seeing spoilery comments regarding the episode from past livebloggers, I merely stay on the first page of comments and comment away, only going back after it’s over in order to comment on what other people said.
Sound fine? Just make sure not to post spoilers before this episode airs.
Have fun! This is my last real-time post before I leave for the AIDS/LifeCycle. Huzzah!
OH SHIT
Oh hello lightbulb. Click on!
Ach, mirrors. 🙁
Aw, jeez. Aw, nuts. Aw, run away run away RUN AWAY!
Aw, dammit.
AAAAAAAAHHHH
AAAAAAAHHHHNNNNOOOOOOOOO!
River Song was introduced in "Silence in the Library," which aired on May 31, 2008.
Amy Pond was introduced in "The Eleventh Hour," which aired on April 3, 2010.
WHEN THE HELL DID MOFFAT DECIDE TO DO THIS. WHY DID HE PICK THESE SPECIFIC NAMES. CAN HE SEE THE FUTURE. WHAT THE HELL.
MY THOUGHTS EXACTLY. I want to pick his brain so bad omg.
Did he know he would be taking over by the time he was writing "Silence in the Library"? If so, he could have known this was coming all along. It's just…why the hell name her RIVER SONG, of all things.
It's possible he only came up with the idea while creating Amy and decided to name her POND, but he had to have known at that time at least because that is WAY too much of a coincidence. So at the very least he's been setting this up since he took over, but holy SHIT, if he actually had this planned back in season four…MY HAT IS OFF TO YOU SIR.
I think he did know that he was taking over when he wrote SItL, but correct me if I'm wrong.
He did.
But I think he said at the time that River Song wasn't meant to become a main character. What's going on Moffat??
Moffat has proven himself to be a total troll, I think!
Untrue. She was always going to be a main character. He'd known for about a year then that he was taking the job
Why do I remember him saying otherwise? MOFFAT HAVE YOU CLIMBED INTO MY HEAD AND STARTED TROLLING THERE, AS WELL?!?
More likely he said something meant to be construed that way and I took it that way because I am naive.
Let me make it worse for you. That whole "we got the name Doctor from you"? Yeah, Moffat thought of that years beforehand. http://tinyurl.com/5w8ltql
Is that real?? Amazing what you can find in archives 😛
DAMNABLE IMPLICATIONS! Be more explicit!
…but we know anyway.
AAAAAAHHHHYESSSSS!
I HAVE SPENT THE LAST HOUR IN FETAL POSITION, NOT BREATHING.
IT'S KIND OF WORRYING.
ALSO, IT'S FINALLY HAPPENED.
I SHIP DOCTOR/RIVER.
IT FEELS LIKE A SIN.
BUT I'M OKAY WITH THAT.
WELCOME TO THE DARK SIDE.
<3
I personally gave in around last season's final episode.
I've heard exciting things about this episode.
Not long now. 😀
This revelation makes me wonder if Moffat always intended for River to be the daughter of a future companion when we see her for the first time in Silence in the Library/Forrest of the Dead or if he just randomly came up with it before series 5/6 started. I like to think it's the former; a long-running plot point like this reminds me of LOST and it's giving me the warm fuzzies. :')
Also, Jenny was in Misfits!
She was the Ice Girl from season 2, Lily or something? AND Tony was 'Colonel Runaway'.
The best my friend and I can piece this together:
Kaitlyn: Ooh, maybe their time streams aren't completely reversed.
Molly.: Well, yeah. They definitely aren't completely reversed.
Kaitlyn: And the River we saw up until the one in America knows that everything's been changed and the Doctor is saved.
Kaitlyn: Because a River in between the earlier Rivers and the Impossible Astronaut one has gone on some adventure in the Doctor's future that makes everything better and changes what happened..
Molly.: Yeah. She must. It's also pretty safe to say that the Doctor's death in the Impossible Astronaut is not his death for real. They wouldn't end the show like that.
Molly.: They'll fix it.
Okay, gathering my thoughts a bit more. This episode is full of so much badass. However. I had to pause it right as the theme rolled, because HOLY SHIT RORY, MY HEART.
"Would you like me to repeat the question?"
RORY IS SUCH A BADASS.
The Doctor only blew up all of those cybermen so that Rory could seize the opportunity to not look back at an explosion and prove what an utter bad ass he is, Michael Bay style.
So, from what I gather, this is what we can construct of River's early life:
She's taken by eye patch lady, who wants to wage war against the Doctor.
She's raised and trained, presumably in the 1960s, to hate the Doctor, and to kill him.
She's put in the suit by the Silence, who are working with eye patch lady.
She kills the greatest man she ever knew, the Doctor.
If that's all true… everything makes sense now. O.o
from TV Tropes.org: "Fridge Horror with a blast of Timey Wimey Mind Screw for the audience. Go back to the first time the Doctor meets River. She knocks out the Doctor, takes his place in the Heroic Sacrifice slot, and lovingly calls Spoilers when explaining why she has to do it. She has to make sure he lives long enough to get her parents on the TARDIS or she won't be born in the first place, which could negate his entire being at the Library in the first place. She had to die in order to be born." mind blown.
holy shit
ZOMG.
THAT IS FREAKISHLY SPOT-ON.
O.O
Hm… OK, I've seen it, and I'm torned (such as some people on the comments before me). Lemme explain!
The episode was, well, EPIC. The pacing, the amount of info, the married anglicans, RORANICUS! Stevie Wonder in 1814! Dr. Song treating the prison as a hotel! Headless Monks! (shivers).
Obviously the main theme of the episode (at least for me) is the fact that the Doctor does not know what he has become: the Oncoming Storm. Yes, from our (and his) point of view, he is the savior of the human race, the defender of the planets, but really, he is not. After all, why was the Pandorica created? To stop the deadliest creature of all time: him. So while it's a repetition of last season's theme, it's put a spin on it: if we can't catch him, we need to kill him. And it's taking a whole religion group to do so. Oh, the power of faith…
Rory it's officially the BADASS of this show. More than Nine, even (and Nine was a warrior). I'm sure Capt. Jack would be DYING to meet him (if you know what I mean). He was calm through his stint with the Cybermen, he detected the hidden truths the Doctor was not saying, and he was crying when he saw his baby. More badass can't be. And I know maybe Arthur Darvill does not have the physical knowledge, but I was dying to see Rory fight (thousands of years as a Nestene Roman should have give him quite an amount of experience in battle, and while we did see a little bit, it was heavily edited. I want a one-shot sequence, but I know I'm dreaming). Roranicus, I bow to thee.
Oh, and if it is true that he has a screwdriver now… OMFG!!!
And the love between Amy and Rory, perfectly cemented (and yes, they are the Ponds). I did hate when they handle like Amy being in love with the Doctor, and then saying it's not: it felt bad when they used it in the Season's Premiere and it felt old this episode; maybe it's me but it feels like cheap writing. However, then Amy and Rory kiss, it's awesome. Both Darvill and Gillian have the body language to make you believe they are in love. In true love.
The Doctor. OK, this episode confirmed it to me. If Nine was a runner from the past, and Ten was the lonely god, Eleven is Peter Pan. The book version. The ageless, heartless book version. When he called Danny Boy, you can see the child shining in glee at the idea of, well, a little violence. Kissing and crying? He was obviously grossed about that. (I loved the fact that he speaks baby!) Not realizing that a couple does the deed on the wedding night (and probably MORE times than that, it's too convenient that the baby was conceived on the first night). And while the old man was definitely in charge of the battle, I was surprised that he could not see the trap. Joy, when they fooled him once. A privilige, to do it twice? I am not so sure about that.
And the cherry in this cake: River Song, Melody Pond, badass Ph.D. in anthropology. OK, I think it was both awesome and underwhelming that he is Amy and Rory's daughter, let me explain why. I think it's awesome that she's the daughter of Amy and Rory because it empowers them: it tells us that her badassery is from the blood we've known for this last adventures (and it's awesome blood: the girl whou could create reality from a memory and the centurion who waited thousands of years). It also shows a new light on the "there are consequences when you travel with the Doctor" story, specially now that a couple who does it is travelling with the Doctor. But it creates a conflict with the character that is River Song (at least to me).
*Continued
When we met River a while ago, we had this (and trust me, I loved her in the episode but she was a) Mary Sue. All her knowledge of the Doctor, her coyness, her having the Doctor wrapped around her finger, she was awesome and yet a little grating the first time we met her. Then she came, and she was showing her badassery, one meeting at the time. And she was taught to drive the TARDIS by the best man she knew (the Doctor wasn't there) and she also killed that man. And I was fascinated by the idea of a couple meeting in the wrong points in time. Maybe their first date was truly the first date for both of them, but the second for the Doctor was the meet-the-parents one for River? There is this fanfic (The Ten times the Doctor met Sailor Pluto, http://reseda-ptah.livejournal.com/50853.html) that outlines that idea (not dating, but meeting in the wrong order) and I was excited for that storytelling.
Now that they've retconned the fact that they meet backwards (I am from your future Rory, I always know) and placed the fact that he knows her from when she's a baby… they are stepping in The Time Traveler's Wife territory, and while I haven't read the book nor seen the movie most of the hatedom I've read for it comes from the fact that a man made a little girl fall in love with her, denying her the idea of falling in love for someone else. Worse, meeting her as a baby and he is kinda already having feelings for her (from my point of view, when he realized who he was, he was practically having a meet-the-parents moment: "But we have (smooched)? How do I look?") begins to toe the waters of… Breaking Dawn (*ducks from all the rotten fruit and vegetables*).
As someone in another recap said (in a beautiful blog post) so far they've outlined River by her association with the Doctor. When I saw that post, I agreed wholly to it, but I was (and am, still) waiting for the show to flip the coin and show us a Doctor completely in love with River, while she barely knows him and is intrigued, but not defined by him. They still can, but that opens a whole new can of worms:
Either Melody is rescued and given back to her parents, where the Doctor becomes "Uncle Doctor" and they fall into the Jacob Black/Vanessa territory (I deny to use the "name", it's just WRONG). Or Melody is not rescued and becomes River Song on her own. Which is indeed a Dark Arc, specially for the kind of show this is becoming. That I would expect from RTD's Doctor, not from Moffat's Doctor. Oh, but I guess we'll find out. In Autumn. Too much time for that, but hopefully I will have BBCA when that arrives, so I won't have to wait (too much) to watch it.
Wishlist!
-I really, really hope they don't go into the Breaking Dawn territory. I expect to see more of River Song, and specially more of River Song detached from the Doctor. A Badass on her own
-More Rory. Specially more AWESOME!Rory. Although any Rory is awesome Rory.
-Are we going to see more of the Silence? Did they know of this plot…?
-River said that she was from the 51st century. We can say now that she settled in the 51st century. Can we have a River/Capt. Jack meeting?
-I might be the only one who wants this, but if I see Eleven as Peter Pan, I wish we can see him grow up. Become Eleven in Utah. Maybe it is the love (for I think it's been truly confirmed: they will love each other at the same time at some point) what makes him grow up. I think it's neeeded.
If you've read all of this, thank you! And I forgot to introduce myself: I'm Alan, longtime lurker but I hope to step more into the light and reject the shadows of lurking from now on.
Hi Alan, you're awesome.
You should cease lurking more often!
You've made me realize – the conception dates are all wrong. If Melody was conceived on their wedding night (6/26/2010) then Amy DEFINITELY would have been showing at Christmas (although…6 month honeymoon? Maybe it was "Christmas" but not really 6 months later?). It isn't clear how much time passed between the Christmas special and TIA, we just know that they've been at home for about 4 months – so right around April-ish. The Doctor said Amy was taken "before America" (delightfully vague). They spent 3 months hunting the Silence, and we saw the child regenerate in New York "6 months later" (Of course, the regeneration could have happened WHILE they were off chasing pirates – the timing wasn't necessarily sequential).
What it comes down to is either Amy was pregnant for AT LEAST 13 months (!!), or the Doctor is straight up wrong about when conception happened, or Amy's kidnapping was just after Christmas and there was some timey wimey stuff happening in the TARDIS that meant Team Tardis lived more months than Amy, or everyone knows the timing's funky but the BBC wants it clear to the kiddos that the baby came AFTER the wedding.
I think I may be overthinking this.
Oops that should have said "Amy's kidnapping was right after the wedding," meaning early enough that she still wasn't showing. That may not have been her in the Christmas episode.
I always figured they didn't wait until Christmas for their honeymoon, the Doctor just put them on some future cruise at Christmas. …But trying to work out this timeline makes my head hurt, especially since I had the impression there were plenty of adventures between series.
You're not overthinking it; it's boiling my mind, too.
i definitely think the conception timing is off. they were married in june of 2010, so her wedding night was 2010. but in TIA River definitely says that they're in 2011 right now. That's a long time. (The Christmasness could just be time travel at work but the 4 months they were at home still makes it 2010, not 2011).
wibbly wobbly.
timey wimey.
"Either Melody is rescued and given back to her parents, where the Doctor becomes "Uncle Doctor" and they fall into the Jacob Black/Vanessa territory (I deny to use the "name", it's just WRONG). Or Melody is not rescued and becomes River Song on her own."
This. I do not want either of those scenarios, because not having Amy and Rory's baby rescued is not nice to the kids who watch Doctor Who (which is still allegedly a family programme…) And having "Uncle Doctor" is squicky, because he knows what's going to happen in the fututre, and although kids might not mind that so much and think it's romantic, what do they know? Twilight is best loved amongst the young.
Theories Abound: I think they're still playing a numbers game. Which could mean option 3: both. There are 2 River Songs/Melody Ponds. On Confidential, Alex Kingston said "How many children have been in that cot? That's all I can say. But 2 Rivers doesn't seem a good idea to me either, although they've been pressing for ganger rights in the previous couple of episodes. It feels like what they did to Rose, they gave her her own Doctor. I did NOT like that.
Wait… Amy felt sick after seeing the silence and so did River. Was it really morning sickness, and River's having some psychic connection to her past self? Or to a different version of herself? Gah, I wish my brain would stop, it's not going to be answered for a VERY LONG TIME. UGH.
Thank you for completely outlining why I had a sinking, squicked feeling when the reveal happened. I am really not sure how they can now handle the Doctor and River falling in love without it being really, really iffy. We'll have to wait and see what happens in the Fall, I suppose.
It's not just a repetition of last season's theme, I'm pretty sure it's a direct continuation. SOMEBODY built the Pandorica and made the TARDIS explode and set the Silence on the Doctor. We still don't know who did it, but I'm seriously thinking that it is the eyepatch lady. I want to know what the hell the Doctor did that pissed her off/scared her so badly that she is convinced the Doctor has to be stopped and has raised a holy army to set her plans in motion. Seriously, the plans are looking like a very intricate Xanatos Gambit at this point. What is her motivation?
the only coherent thought is
I need more Victorian Silurian lady detective stories.
yesterday.
yessssssssss
Have been re-watching The Time of The Angels this afternoon and it is the biggest mindtrip now, knowing that Amy is River's mum.
Plus, if the Doctor and River DO get married at some point in the future, that would make Amy his Mother-In-law, loling forever at that.
Which would mean the Doctor made out with his Mother-In-Law… the night before her wedding to his Father-In-Law
HA! Oh my god, pass the brain bleach, please 😀
I have to cheer for a moment for that final battle. Not only was everyone a BAMF (Rory especially with his sword-gun-fu) but how on earth did they win?! What was it, 5 people against a whole bunch of headless lightning-sword-wielding monks? Go Team Tardis!
<img src="http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p150/Falcon823/doctorcyberdance.gif">
Also did they say where the space pirates went?
That battle was a diversion whilst Eye Patch Lady got away with the real baby. As soon as the flesh-baby was melted the monks became expendable.
"Quite a lot of red. Hope its not to hide the stains."
Its totally to hide the stains.
Still not quite sure what I thought of the entire thing; the big-epic-battle-for-the-ages thing (complete with extremely Star Wars-style set pieces and designs) left me kind of cold, but ultimately there was enough meat on the extremely sprawling and far-flung skeleton of plot to make for a good mid-season finale. And there's just something about the fact that this whole time (this whole freakin' time! Donna, Ten, the Library, way back into Season Four) River's beautiful name has just been a lost-in-translation muck-up of Amy and Rory's. There's something gobsmackingly gorgeous about that.
Rewatched and I noticed, in the beginning, River is gushing to Rory about how her birthday went like a little kid.
I noticed that too, she just seemed so happy to be able to talk to him on her birthday, like it was a lovely surprise present.
I'm getting the feeling that River didn't get to see her real parents much as a kid.
oh lord, this just punched me in the soul like the fist of an angry god.
Yeah, and the fact that everyone knows her as River Song and not Melody Pond suggests she grew up without her parents, I think. 🙁
(Though she turns out pretty kick-ass, so a happy ending, anyway.)
I just rewatched The Time of Angels and this is all probably in my head and ridiculous, but River almost ignores Amy and doesn't even speak to her until after Amy asks to be introduced. Until this episode I always thought that it was a jealousy thing or something, but now I wonder if it is a River wouldn't be able to pretend she couldn't recognize her own mother thing. Like she wasn't trying to be cold, but she wouldn't be able to fake her way through not being warm. If Alex Kingston knew since the beginning, this is a wonderful acting choice.
Well since River and the doctor keep meeting in the wrong order she had already met Amy and had not realized that Amy hadn't met her yet. And Alex Kingston is AMAZING and I think she knew from the beginning
Something else that just occurred to me. In the beginning, Amy is telling the baby all about her father, The Last Centurion, and about how badass and awesome he is.
And then Rory shows up in Centurion-wear and asks if River knows him.
And when she sees him she asks if the guards have started dressing as Romans now like she suggested in a memo
And I just realised, awwww, she's telling her Dad!
Don't understand why River was so swamped with emotion when she met Rory this time — why all of a sudden was she connecting so strongly with her Dad — after all she had already met and spent time with both Rory and Amy.
Her reaction to Rory at Stormcage was so strong that even he sort of did a double-take — like whoa!
Loved this episode but definitely would have liked it stretched out for another hour. The production values were amazing — and I appreciated it all the more after watching Doctor Confidential — Dorium's nightclub — a bar in Cardiff — who would have thought it?
It could be for some reason we haven't learned about yet or, since she was younger then usual it could have just been exciting for her to have the Last Centurion show up at her birthday party.
Another random musing of mine. I've been wondering why the hell Eyepatch Lady did things the way she did. I mean, sure, I get fooling the Doctor long enough to scoot away with the baby, but why hang around waiting for him in the first place? Why give them a fake baby only to pull the plug so soon? Why leave a bunch of Headless Monks to show up and start murderfacing his friends, seeing as, if the baby's meant to kill the Doctor, then clearly she didn't expect the Monks to succeed at killing him?
This can all be explained by her having a layered plot with lots of contingency plans (which I'll probably understand more of on rewatch), but my conclusion is that Eyepatch Lady is just very dedicated to being a TOTAL TRAUMATIZING ASSHOLE.
I DON'T THINK THERE WAS EVER ANY DOUBT TO THIS
My theory is that Flesh!bebe was only meant to fool them long enough for Eyepatch to get away – after that, if they'd twigged, maybe the Doctor could have tracked the original from the flesh copy? I know he didn't with Amy, but that's because she was going into labour right the hell then.
It's a thought!
Plus, I think she'd still be happy to have the Doctor killed any way – there must be lots of things you can do with a tame Time Lord apart from that. 🙁
Eyepatch Lady clearly has a massive Xanatos Gambit in play.
Not just future adventures with her, though! Adventures with Amy. This just occurred to me: if River hadn't sacrificed herself in the library, she would never have been born! I know a lot of people think River's "it'll kill me [when the doctor no longer recognizes me]" line at the beginning of this season somehow "cheapened" the fact that she gave her life to save the Doctor because she just ~gave up on life~ as soon as she realized he would never know the real River again (or various other versions of that premise), which I never really agreed with because that seems reliant on a pretty flat reading of River's character, IMHO.
This episode, though, proves that River's reasoning up to her death wasn't just "oh well, why live if I can't see the Doctor again" or "I'll never have all that fun with the Doctor! It was so much fun it’s worth dying!" but that she never would have existed at all if the Doctor had died in the library.
This is still fucked up in a way I haven't even begun to parse, but certainly better than the idea of River as a person hopeless and possibly suicidal over the prospect of no longer having the Doctor in her life.
River died so that she could live.
WHICH IS PRETTY HORRIBLE. MOFFAT, WHYYYYYYYY?
Again, all the sadness forever. :<
Okay, finally sorted my internet out! HERE WE GO !!!!! 😀
The music playing over the 'previously' is sad
BABY
Melody Pond… okay, MELODY. Daughter of a red head. I'm sorry but Little Mermaid 2 much?
Screw you eye patch lady!
Cybermen!
Hmmm, wonder who that chick who looked slightly uncomfortable was? Will she be important?
Amy, I know you trust the doctor and everything but RORY!!!!???
Oh okay, it was Rory. I forgive you!
YAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAYYYYYYY YOU BAMF!
Rory! RORY I LOVE YOU.
loooool, good opening.
OMG, how did I not twig the Little Mermaid 2 similarity? How???
Clearly the episode has damaged my brain.
'An entire cyberlegion, just to prive a point'
There's that chick again. Sewing… well she's definately gonna be something
You can practise on pyshcic paper?
'We're the gay thin fat anglican marines'
'He said 'run' '
Was her name Lorna Bucket?
FAT MARINE? (is it the same guy?)
Do they ACTUALLY cut off the heads. That's cool. Gruesome, but cool. Good to have some literal things?
SULERIAN. lol, what?
POTATO HEADS.
AAAAAARGH SO MUCH GOING OOOOOON.
What, he's nice- oh wait, they'll battle later. Cool.
'I hope someday to meet you in the heat of battle… something crush your human form!'
'This is River Song, back in my usual cell!' GOOD TIMES.
WHY ARE YOU TALKING TO HIM LIKE THAT?
Let me guess…. he's gonna die.
'Unless there's two of them." 'That's a whole different birthday' hhahahahah
'Have you considered heels?'
Okay, I'll admit I've already watched this clip.
WHO ARE YOU RIVER SONG.
OK… It's a third of the way through the episode AND THE DOCTOR HASN'T EVEN SHOWN HIS FACE.
Dorian, I kind of like you! He says it like it is! THE DOCTOR IS GONNA GET CHU!
'Demon's run, where a good man goes to war'
Hehehehehhehhehehee.
*chuckle*
YOU DON'T NEED ME. HAAHAHHA
'I'm fat! I'm blue!" lol.
Okay, a shadow! That's something.
'Can I borrow your gun?' 'Why?' 'Because I think you're going to keep talking'
Bucket, you're a bit weird.
ON THIS DAY IN THIS PLACE. THE DOCTOR WILL FALL.
Oh dear *sigh*
Wonder what the Headless Monks have against the doctor?
'The papal mainframe' ???
YAY LITERAL NAME!
DOCTOR!!!!!!!
SURPRISED!
GUUUUUUUUUNS.
AMELIA POND! GET YOUR COAT!
Okay, this episode is really really weird. BUT I LIKE IT.
'We are not fools' – Interesting Mantra.
YES, C'MON WEIRDEST GROUP OF ALLIES EVER! WIN!
LOL WHAT! Call back to Victory of the Daleks, cool!
RORANICUS!
LOL PIRATES.
This is ridiculous. AND AWESOME.
'Run away' He sounded quite a bit like Jack Sparrow then!
Doctor, you're being a bit scary.
'I'm really cross!' 'Yeah I know that.'
YAY RORY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
'I wanted to be cool!' 'Crying Roman with a Baby. You're cool'
'Melody Williams' "…Is a geography teacher. Melody Pond is a superhero.'
Oh this is going WAY too well.
HAHAHAHAHAHA! OH GOD. Sontaran WITH BOOBS.
Awwww Doctor 🙁
'Be aware, I do have a sword'
'Just before America.' Ahh there goes the warehouse theory?
'It's mine' GOD DON'T DO THAT DOCTOR! *sigh*
YAY TIME BABY!
'They don't put up a balloon!'
I don't really care as long as its Rory's and Amy's 😀
Hello again, creepy eye patch lady!
I knew she was going to say 'Against you'. Really, what do they have against him?
What have they done to the TARDIS?
'THAT'S THE ATTACK PRAYER!' OH NOES!
Amy, you're useless.
DON'T KISS YOUR KID GOODBYE RORY. THAT'S NOT GOOD.
DORIAN DON'T BE STUPID
Too late.
ITS A FLESH BABY!?
OH THAT WOULD SUCK!!!
Okay, its near the end. WHAT ABOUT RIVER?
'I've had a good life. I'm nearly 12'
SO MUCH SAD.
Is that Bucket chick going to be River? She did say she met him as a kid?
Nope, she's dead?
Okidoki then…
Hello River! Why am I worried!
River, why you so mean?
'WHO ARE YOU'
DUN DUN DUN
OKAY WHAT. WHAT.
WHAT DOES IT SAY.
WHERE ARE YOU GOING.
BLOODY HELL.
TELL US.
TELL US.
OKAY
YAY.
DO IT.
TELL US.
OH REALLY.
RIVER SONG
MELODY POND.
OH CRAP.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA.
SHIT!
HAHAHHAHAHAHAH
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
Oh goodness.
SHOULD HAVE SEEN THAT COMING.
Her name isn't Lorna Bucket because it's pronounced Bouquet!!! As in, Lorna is the great-great-great-etc-granddaughter of Hyacinth Bucket – er, s'cuse me, "Bouquet".
HOLY SHIT DOCTOR WHO. WHAT THE HELL. I CAN'T I DON'T EVEN WHAT IS AHHHHHHHH!!!!!! SO AMAZING.
My first thought about River being Amy and Rory's daughter was this:
OMG YAY THAT MEANS SHE WILL BE GOOD AND NOT KILL THE DOCTOR!!!
But then I realized: River was in prison for 'killing the greatest man she ever knew' and I was all like NOOOOOOOOOOO!!!
But then again… If she's Rory's daughter… Could she be talking about Rory!? NOOOOOO!!!
STEVEN MOFFAT, WHAT ARE YOU DOING TO MY BRAINNNN.
Given that the whole season has involved "does she mean Rory or the Doctor?" fake outs, I (fearfully) assume that the "good man" River kills is Rory, not the Doctor. D:
But Moff will know that so he will make it the Doctor. But then we know he knows that so it will be Rory. And yet he will know that we know he know so it …
I am thinking (hoping) he is doing all these Rory/Doctor fakeouts to surprise us when it is the Doctor in the end. But I think it is absolutely impossible to guess.
My wild guess is it would be the Doctor, because no matter how amazing Rory is, I don't think River would be put in a supermegaultra-prison for killing 'a mere human'. A Timelord on the other hand, the 'last of his kind' even… They would probably put her into the superprison for that.
But it will be too obvious…. IT COULD ME ANYONE!!!! IT COULD EVEN BE WILFRED!!!
NOT WILF. YOU SPEAK BLASPHEMY.
..Seriously though. MOFF, YOU DO NOT TOUCH WILF. YOU HEAR THAT?!
I think just about EVERYTHING implies its the doctor and considering we saw him die its probably the doctor. So unless they somehow replace the Doctor with Rory (oh shit) it looks like she's going to kill the doctor. I'm also pretty sure it was her in the astronaut suit as a reference to her first appearance in the show. Now wait until the end of the series and I will be wrong about everything.
Oh dang oh dang oh daaaaaang Melody Pond= River Song. Please tell me they did this to confuse us and it's not true. Please please please.
What? It can't be.For a moment I forgot that Rory had also lived hundreds of years (wow, never thought about it this way, but he's older than The Doctor!) and for a moment I was genuinely confused that they were going do breach A MOST GRIEVOUS WALL there and actually make it the Doctor's kid somehow. Thank goodness!
Awwwh, Amy is such a good mummy. All protective, even though she's been practically unconscious throughout the entire pregnancy.
Oooh, this one was written by Moffat? I shall snuggle myself in for a most excellent telling of a story.
Ha, I feel bare laying my theories out like this, but I think That girl who is sewing there (who was also at the birth of Melody?) is totally River, regardless or not of whether Melody=River.
What the heck Why are people going to fight the Doctor and getting all prepared by learning about psychic paper and stuff.
Those thingswith the hoods look like the creepy things that Cassandra used as a distraction in one of the very first new Who episodes 😮 Apparently they are not, they're headless monks? Well they look like Dementors to me 😛 ("Nearly headless? How can you be NEARLY headless?")
Lolololol, @ the Thin-Fat-Gay-Married-Anglican-Marines 😛
Lorna Bucket, was it? A false name? Or maybe not young River after all. Now I wanna know how she plays into the episode!
Nope, nope, nope, Gamma Forests? Calling it now. "The only water in the Forest is the River". TOTES River.
What's in the boxes? Betcha it's their heads.
LOLWhat's with the random Sontaran? Oh, lolol at his line. I thought he was all out of character for a moment 😀
HE'S COLLECTING A DA! DUMBLEDORE'S– no, the DOCTOR'S ARMY!!
Hahaha, River makes me laugh. Being all dainty.
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: Unless there's two of them… that's a different birthday…
Ugh, you know it's gotta be serious when River actually explains it rather than cheekily answering "Spoilers."
"I'm old! I'm fat! I'm blue! You can't need me!"
Ahhhh… hmmm… that girl does have an American accent, which is odd… well maybe regardless of whether nor not Melody=River, this girl could be Melody. Ah, never mind, she doesn't have an American accent, does she?
Ouch Amy. Ouch. I know things suck right now, but ouch.
The whacked out religion/cult/army thing freaks me out.
GOOD ENTRANCE SIR! JOLLY GOOD SHOW!
The girl totes has a crush on the Doctor, so she MUST be River 😛 Although I suppose, who DOESN'T have a crush on him?
I still want to know why these people want this child so badly in the first place!
HAHAHAHAHA. You. Are. Fools.
Nuuu, dun take teh bebe!
And what's this about a trap? Traps=no good. Although if there's one thing we've learned, it's never to put the Doctor into one.
"Oh look I'm angry, that's new. I'm really not sure what's going to happen now."
SO SCARY. And his delivery. Subtle and brilliantly done. KUDOS MATT SMITH
YAYYYYY BEBE! But what if what if what if. I just had a thought and it scares me. These people seem well planned out. What if they already fleshed her and it's a flesh bebe?!
"Oh God, I was gonna be cool. I wanted to be cool."
*HUGS FOREVER TO RORY*
Awww, unfortunate, I was totally right. I bet he's totally sniffing them to make sure the baby smells like Amy.
HE SPEAKS BABY! THAT IS ADORABLE! AND CAPS LOCK WORTHY!
Rory, he knows things. And now his heart is heavy because he knows that things will crash and burn.
OHMYGOSH THAT LINE from the Sontaran was disturbing and yet hilarious. Lactating fluids.
Oh come on Doctor, you've been told you're a weapon before. Or am I missing something else that's clicking over in your mind?
The way "Lorna" said "Centurion, you're needed" sounded like "Sweetie, I need you" 😛 Man, I'm gonna feel so silly if she's not River.
Lol, okay, so she's *not* River? Who the heck is she? She's can't be throwaway. Oh hey, I guess if she's Melody… oh wait. Oh right. Duh. She can regenerate if she's Melody, and if River is Melody then it all still works.
HELLO RIVER! I LOVE YOU! I MISSED YOU! I LOVE YOU!
Oooh, the Gamma Forests again.
Oh, so it's unfortunate, but at the same time hilarious. Well done again Matt Smith on the reaction. I mean, I guess it's not confirmed, but it's as good as confirmed that River is Amy's baby, isn't it?
Now it's confirmed. Squee squee squee squee. Okay, I didn't like the idea at first but they've handled it. They've handled it so well. Well done all. Jolly good show.
Autumn 2011: Let's Kill Hitler? Wow, ummmm…. big topic to cover in an episode now isn't it.
There was actually a well-documented episode of the people close to Hitler trying to bump him off. I assume that's what this is about. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1944_Adolf_Hitler_as…
There's even a film called "The Plot to Kill Hitler"
Is anyone else concerned? Eye patch lady said that the doctor should think he's winning till the trap closes, and River said he'd fall further than ever before… it doesn't seem like the ten depressing minutes in which the doctor realises what these people see him as constitute as falling further than ever before (especially in comparison to timelord victorious…). So is something even worse going to happen at the very beginning of the second half of the series?
Absolutely. I think the worst is yet to come.
Teaser Spoiler just in case
Given the tag line for the second half seems to be 'Times Runs Out' I'd say that's definitely likely.
Time runs out? Like what the doctor and river were talking about in flesh and stone/ the angels two parter? Hmmm… might just have to rewatch that episode.
OK, I love that there are multiple gay couples in this episode, but am I the only person who thought the Silurian/human couple's "don't know why you put up with me"/Silurian tongue whip action scene was a BS shorthand way to depict that relationship? As in, viewer goes "Are they a couple? OH THE LIZARD DID A BIG TONGUE THING AND LESBIANS ARE ALL ABOUT THAT SO YEAH". I just don't see how the super-long phallic tongue makes sense outside of hetero male fantasy. What would a long, venomous tongue do for a woman, exactly? That's several feet more tongue than I would ever want and the tip of it is apparently very poisonous, so… this feels good how?
I thought that, too, but especially when the Silurian said, "She's *definitely* a girl."
"what would a long tongue do for a woman"
Erased 'venemous' cos I'm assuming that can be controlled. You know what cunnilungus is, yes? Lesbian couples engage in that all the time. And many hetero males consider going down on a girl to be gross.
TBH i like the subtlety because heterosexual couples are hardly presented with HEY THIS IS MY PARTNER, WE'RE HETEROSEXUAL. It was pretty clear to most people who watched that they're actually involved with each other.
Um, yes I know what cunnilingus is, having given and received it and I really don't see how a six foot long tongue improves things. That length seems unwieldy, not stimulating, and the tip of the tongue always seemed to work best for me and my partners, so the whole "poison" thing at the tip of the Silurian tongue is a bit of a turn off. It's possible both the length and poisonous aspect could be controlled, but the show was all about "LOOK AT MY HUGE TONGUE, OF COURSE YOU LOVE IT" which, given my experiences, seemed pretty stupid.
…and part of my point was that this wasn't subtle, at least to me.
The way it SHOT OUT alarmed me a bit. Like, that beaning a person in the cervix? No fun, no fun!!
The "hey guys, guys, lesbian hints!!" buts of dialogue seemed clunky to me too.
Sorry, but the idea of getting beaned in the cervix is the funniest thing I've heard all day xD
It's more subtle than "we're the gay couple", which was in the same episode.
And I figured it was a reference to the flexibility of the tongue… *shrug* I guess I read into it differently than you, but it is there so I can't argue that it wasn't.
Are you like one of those people who disapprove of f/f couples using dildos because that's giving in to the patriarchy
what? No. I just thought the way this was done in the show is silly.
OK, I should clarify: I am speaking as a bisexual woman. The whole tongue thing struck me as an unnecessary phallic metaphor – she "puts up with" the Silurian for her huge tongue and the implied sexings, when (in my experience) actually pleasing a woman has nothing to do with the length of the tongue at all. It seemed like a stupid way to point out a same sex relationship with an opposite sex relationship trope that is stupid in it's own right.
ETA… and I'm not saying anything phallic is bad, or that people can't use dildoes or anything either. I thought it was a crap portrayal of women's sexuality in a long history of crap portrayals. Sorry if I upset anyone, I think it was just because I didn't explain myself and where I was coming from, but if it was something else, please tell me.
Maybe thats just what she finds personally pleasing? This isn't just a same-sex relationship, its an interspecies one so the rules might be a bit different. But what the fuck do I know?
Apologies. I can't comment on the portrayalness of it because any sexual overtone in that scene (where she stunned the prisoner who was trying to escape, right?) completely over my head.
This is not a novel phenomenon.
…at least I got to enjoy "oi, get in here!"
Aaaaaand neither is accidentally my verbs.
No worries, I obviously did a terrible job of explaining my thoughts. My issues were with the writing of the scene and how the couple's sexuality was depicted, not the couple themselves or their relationship… apparently everybody assumed I meant the latter.
I don't think I'd noticed she stunned the guy – that just makes the scene seem even weirder to me.
Extra comments:
Love that post-birth Amy doesn't immediately look super thin again. Post-pregnancy weight is usually omitted from this stuff (NOT TO MENTION ALL THE OTHER POSTPARTUM ISSUES. PLZ ADDRESS THIS, ESPECIALLY SINCE WHAT HAPPENED TO AMY IS WAY TRAUMATIZING).
Bow ties, fezzes, and possibly stetsons: not cool. Crying Romans with babies: definitely cool…? Amy and I agree about the crying Romans, at least.
"Oi. You. Get in here. Now." ARE WE SURE THIS ISN'T HOW TIME LORD DNA GOT IN THE MIX IN THE FIRST PLACE. …just hoping.
I KNOW RITE! (Re "Oi, you! Get in here now!")
the doctor was all "Kissing! :O" and then Rory was all "Get in here, you ;)"
(I may be changing the wording and tone…maybe… :P)
My anxiety to see this episode has now been replaced by an anxiety to find out what Mark thinks about it. CURSE YOU MARK, FOR WRITING INTERESTING THINGS BUT SKIPPING WEEKENDS BECAUSE YOU HAVE LIKE, A LIFE OR SOMETHING.
Isn't Mark now skipping a week for lifecycle? Or did I get the date wrong?
The liveblog post says this is the last realtime post, so I assume he's got at least one review canned in advance?
As this hasn't been discussed, what about the skeleton hand with lit sonic right after the end credits? Looked like it was underwater to me.
Isn't it supposed to count as spoiler?
I didn't see it as a trailer as such, more part of the whole. If not, my bad, sorry.
I missed that. Someone please describe it! I stopped watching and now I can't see it again for at least a week! HEEEEEEEELLLLLLLLLLPPPPPPP!
There were like 5 different things here that deserved their own episode. I wish Moffat would write a whole series.
Ok, I'm a day behind, but here are my reactions to the episode:
-Eeeeeeeeeeeee~! Episode is starting!!!! <3
-Eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!!!!!
-Creepy lady is creepy.
-Baby~ <3
-Poor baby. D= They can’t steal her away… :<
-I love how she’s talking to the baby like it understands her, lol.
-hahaha, the Doctor IS her father? XD Poor Rory. :<
-Rory the Roman. <3
-I love Rory so much right now.
-Headless people are creepy. XD;
-Homo reptilia~!
-Sontaran? What? XD;
-Looks like the Doctor is gathering an army. <3
-hahahaha, River. XD I love her forever.
-River’s timeline thing confuses me so much.
-???????
-Ah-ha! Knew River would play an important part in things.
-I still don’t like eyepatch lady. >>;
-Hahaha, his turn for debt. XD
-“I’m fat, I’m blue, you can’t need me!” X’D Nice.
-The leaf is pretty. :3
-DOCTOR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! =D
-hahaha, light sabers, nice. XD
-Turning them against the monks, nice. XD
-They’re totally fools. XP
-Niiiiiice. X’D Army time, lmbo.
-baby~…. :<
-hahahaha, the pirates. XD
-Doctor kicks aaaaaass. <3
-I hate eyepatch lady.
-Rory and baby~! <3
-Sweet moment. <333
-Roryyyyyyy~ <3
-hahaha, Doctor. X’D
-The Doctor speaks baby. EPIC. WIN! XD
-Aw~ Cutest crib ever. XD
-hahahaha, sex on the Tardis. Whoo~ XD
-Aaaaand now the Tardis is blocked off. Lovely.
-Blue guy is dead.
-Blue guy is headless. o_o;
-Another ganger Amy? /Really/?
-Ganger /baby/? D’= too wrong. :’<
-Nurse Sontaran is dead. :’<
-Aaaand other girl is dead now too. Sad.
-…. Is River about to kill him?
-Is River seriously their child? X’D lmao.
-All the crack theories were right. Nice. X’D
Haha, and now we know why Sexy said “The only water in the forest is the river.” XP Fun times. <3
I'm still unsure about the 'only water in the forest is the river' thing. First, weren't they quite far away from the Tardis when River said it? (I may be wrong about that.) And second, why would that be an important thing for Rory to know? Was he meant to figure it out before River explained it or something?
River didn't say it, Sexy did as she was dying. XD As for why, who knows? The Tardis was saying all sorts of things out of order that episode, so I think that was more a hint to us as fans than for Rory to really understand the river/pond translation bit.
I was rather confused about this too. Surely the Tardis knew that River would tell them, so why did she need to tell them too? :/
THEORIES ABOUND
Here's one thing that's been cooking in my brain. River mentioned how there being 2 Doctors was a whole other birthday. This seems significant even if my brain is automatically forced into Captain Jack territory. (Or jumping eagerly into that territory, it's up to you to decide :D)
But doesn't this mean that at some point we haven't seen yet, there are two Doctors!?
Well, some have theorized that flesh!Doctor survived.
Or it could just be the Doctor crossing his own timeline to celebrate a birthday with River that he already celebrated with her before? Dangerous to do, but not entirely unseen in this show.
There definitely WERE two Doctors in the first episode: Future Doctor who was 1108 and Present Doctor who was 908. Who's to say that Future Doctor wasn't a Ganger who'd gone off to set up an elaborate plan?
My theory:
The Doctor goes off at some point to create another Flesh!Doctor, and sends that one off to get killed by River in the spacesuit, while inviting everybody to watch. River (who may or may not be the little girl at this point) then reports to eyepatch lady that the Doctor is dead. Older River and all his friends were there to watch it, so they can ALSO confirm that the Doctor died. Meanwhile, the Doctor and/or River set up some kind of complicated trap for Eyepatch Lady and her holy army to shut her down.
ooh, I like this theory. It seems just the right amount of long con/shock and awe/timey wimey that it would be plausible!
Well, the Eyepatch Lady definitely seems to have a wacky Xanatos Gambit in play, because we still haven't learned who blew up the TARDIS/created the Pandorica last season, and with as much as they're building her up I'm pretty sure it's her. However, the Doctor can totally play that game as well, especially if he knows now that he's supposed to die on that date and baby Melody is being raised as a weapon against him. He went to check out the Flesh in its "early stages" for a purpose, and I can't think that that purpose was ONLY to deactivate Flesh!Amy.
What gets really timey-wimey is River's timeline. Just thinking about it makes my head hurt. How much does she know and when does she know it? Was it six year old Melody in the spacesuit that killed the Doctor or was it adult River? Was it someone else entirely? (The only candidate I can think of is if it was Eyepatch Lady in some weird twist?)
She's being held as an adult by the church (apparently the same church that is working with Eyepatch Lady) and seems to be quite comfortable working with them. At Crash of the Byzantium we heard that she was being offered a pardon– a pardon by who? If Eyepatch Lady is the head of the church (and she kinda seems to be) then what would River have done that required a pardon? Would it be going against her plan to kill the Doctor? She said she killed 'the greatest man she'd ever known' but they can't be imprisoning her for killing the Doctor because that's what they want her to do.
There are so many questions and possibilities here it's just ridiculous.
And in The Rebel Flesh they made a point of saying, when Cleaves killed that ganger "He had a heart! And you stopped it!" The Doctorganger has two – and they can also be stopped, no?
Your theory is awesome. I salute it.
Well, the Rebel Flesh / Almost People had two doctors and that was her actual BIRTH day…!
Well, that was…well, it demanded a reaction. A day later and I'm still pondering over it. I think I won't be able to really know what I think of it until the whole season's finished. I had kinda hoped the revelation would be something that no one could possibly have guessed, but hey.
I'd have liked more information about who the Eye Patch Lady is and the specifics of who she's in league with. I suspect (or hope, at least) that this will be revealed later and gradually.
THEORIES ABOUND
I actually have a sneaking suspicion that "Let's Kill Hitler" won't literally be about killing Hitler. Rather, it's going to refer to the Doctor going back in time to avert the creation or onset of, say, the Eye Patch Lady, or some other, similar thing. I mean, when you think about it, "Let's Kill Hitler" wouldn't be a completely inappropriate title for "Genesis of the Daleks."
Just a silly idea of mine.
ahhhhhhh 🙁 that makes me so sad for all the hundreds of people that he must have affected (wait, effected or affected?) so much, and he doesn't realise. Oh god, it reminds me of Love and Monsters! I wonder how many 'LINDAs' (is that what it was called? did i just make that up?) there are in the world… scratch that, the universe.
though I do hope the doctor really *does* remember every one of them, his temporary companions, almost companions, allies, and randoms that run with him.
All comments in one post because aargh, can't take eyes off screen to find the 'submit' button.
Centurion Rory – BLATANT FAN-SERVICE. Moar plz.
Aww, Rory is a legend … just what every little girl wants, a Daddy who will BLOW UP ENTIRE SPACE FLEETS to rescue her.
Melody Pond? MELODY POND?! Well there goes THAT reveal.
No one should look that good after just having a baby. I put this down to uber-future tech.
Wait WHAT sword-wielding Silurian lesbian of DOOM who just killed Jack the Ripper??!!! adlkjghasd;hgdh;asd SPIN-OFF SERIES NOW PLZ!
'I'm not breaking out, I'm breaking back in'. No one should have that much fun screwing with people's heads. I'M LOOKING AT YOU, MOFFAT.
Wait no the 'good man' River's supposed to kill … not RORY?!
Sontaran 'Nurse'. (dies laughing)
Okay so this is epic and awesome and I'm disturbing the neighbours with my one-person cheer squad but WHY DO I THINK SOMETHING IS GOING TO GO VERYVERY WRONG
'Thin fat gay married Anglican marines' – these guys are brilliant SO YOU'RE GOING TO KILL THEM RIGHT MOFFAT
Headless monks … eeurughghghgh this can't end well
Dammit I KNEW it … *sob* poor headless fat gay married marine
Five bucks says the Doctor's one of the robed guys on the platform.
HAH. PAY UP HOUSEHOLD
Awwwwww he just happens to have a cot in the TARDIS … complete with accessories guaranteed to produce a really STRANGE baby … wait, he carries his own cot around? Dude, that's seriously awkward.
This is all WAY too easy. Plus smug eyepatch woman is smug.
Wedding night … guess the bunk beds didn't work, huh Doctor?
I KNEW IT … renegerating alley girl is Pond baby … is River … but wait, she did the thing with the suit and the TARDIS and … HEAD ASPLODE
Last stand at the OK TARDIS …
Nooooo old fat blue man, stay away from the headless sith lords!
TWO THUDS. Ugh. Ugh. Ugh.
'No offense to the other guys but … let them die first.'
'You are so Scottish.'
Rory with gun and gladius … nnnngggggggggggnnn
Silurian and badass cross-dressing maid … NNNGGGGGGGGGGGNNNNNNNNNN I MAY ASPLODE FROM SHEER AWESOMENESS
Captain Eyepatch: I shall taunt you a second time, Doctor.
LOVE the Doctor's 'oh shit' look. YES, you idiot, this is what happens when you go on a crusade. How many regenerations is it going to take before you GET it!?
DALAKFHDSAGHGD;KDJSAFWEPOIJDSAF AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHH BABY IS FLESH MOFFAT YOU BASTARD NONONONONONO
'WE KNOW'. WOW. INTENSE RORY IS INTENSE
I would NOT want to be Captain Eyepatch when Rory catches up with her.
Aaaand the big reveal … WE ARE ALREADY THERE GUYS
LOL at Doctor making kissy-kissy face at River
So all this time River was hanging around with her Mum and Dad and said nothing?? … or wait maybe she lost her memory of her Mum … ohhhh too sad
Can TOTALLY see Rory giving the Doctor the 'RESPECT MY DAUGHTER OR I WILL SKEWER YOU WITH MY ROMAN SWORD' talk.
AAARRRRRGGGGGGGHHH knew it was going to end there but but but AAAARRRRGHGHGHGHGGH CANNOT WAIT UNTIL SEPTEMBER MOFFAT WHY YOU SO EVIL
Wait … 'LET'S KILL HITLER'?! o_O
WILL NOW CHEW FINGERS OFF UNTIL SEPTEMBER COMES WHY DO I NOT HAVE A TARDIS
Wait … Rory can TOTALLY pull rank on the Doctor. He's OLDER.
It's funny because I originally heard the "the little girl is Amy's daughter who is River" and actually bought it and thought "that is totally something Moffat would do." Then I just sort of grew away from it thinking "well, if someone actually thought it up this early, it's probably not going to happen."
THEN, during this episode, I was convinced Lorna was River. THEN, when she was shot and River appeared, I thought River was going to give the Doctor some sort of healing medicine to heal Lorna who was River. THEN, when River showed the Doctor who she was with the cot, I thought she was saying she was his daughter, and I was ENTIRELY SQUICKED OUT.
So basically, I subconsciously disallowed myself to beleive the theory that I ALREADY HEARD until the word came out of River's mouth herself. So I was STILL surprised.
Same with me. They hid it all in plain sight. When I saw Amy's baby's name I thought, "No, there's no way they'd be that obvious… it's got to be a red herring…" but no.
And even though I didn't want it to be like this, the way they handled it made it all excellent.
The Doctor got all the soldiers to disarm *themselves* by dressing as a monk and turning the lights off. DOCTOR, WHY SO AWESOME?
I keep adding stuff from TV tropes because I need to share the brilliance of others that make my head asplode:
"A retroactive Fridge Horror moment from Torch Lighter: Remember when the Doctor dies in the first episode, and River burns his body because "… there are whole empires who would rip this world apart for a single cell?" She knows that from personal experience… she was raised by one such Empire."
asdfghjklskjgdkdfhgdiukhgfjhvfcgckv
It is definitely a very readable book. His writing style is very interesting and it does suck you in. But the actual story… yeah, I'm still deeply conflicted over it. I didn't really like how they felt they had to "explain" the time travel with some genetic nonsense, and I really, really didn't like the relationship between the two of them. It was just very weird and didn't seem very realistic, and I resented the fact that she just… accepted this relationship would happen and didn't even bother dating other people? But by far the most frustrating bit was where he specifically tells her "don't wait for me, go have a life" and she just ignores that advice. The whole thing was just… off. It's an interesting book, but a great love story? No.
I got the impression that she would actually have moved on and lived her own life if he hadn't then said to her 'you will see me again'. And so she then spends the rest of her life waiting for him. I wanted to slap them both.
"Unless they met in his past and he really doesn't remember her- because for her it was the biggest, most important day of her life, and for him it was Tuesday. "
That's the most beautiful comment I've read in this whole liveblog. All of the internet cookies to you.
In in the interest of full disclosure, I stole that from, um, the Street Fighter movie.
(OH THE SHAME)
But, as they say, good writers borrow from other writers. Great writer flat-out steal.
Thank you!
You know, it sounded really familiar, but I think that's from the TVtropes page, or one of the many times that quote was ripped off in TV shows.
Just a bit less than 13 hours left to go for those of us in America~
You are going to have so much fun watching it. Its GREAT.
Oooh, Cybermen.
"I have a message and a question. A message from the Doctor and a question from me. Where. Is. My. Wife?"
Oh Rory, kicking ass and taking names.
So, guy's being converted to a Headless Monk. DNW.
I don't see why that means you can't be with him until the very end. FFFF.
Heh, guess I'm the only one liveblogging this. Oh well.
Surprise. Didn't expect that, did they?
I wonder why Eyepatch Woman is going through all this trouble to beat the Doctor. I suspect we won't find out for awhile though.
Yeah, shut down, Rory. It's Pond, not Williams.
So, it's the Doctor's cot. And apparently having sex on the TARDIS results in a baby human/Time Lord hybrid. Still doesn't explain why the Eyepatch Woman wants to kill the Doctor.
Melody was a Ganger and the real one's been kidnapped? That bitch.
Well, that's certainly going to change dynamics. Now that we know that River is Amy and Rory's daughter, that still leaves the question of how she and the Doctor ended up with their timelines moving in reverse.
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