Oh god OH MY GOD. For those of us who will either be watching the actual BBC airing of the mid-season finale or, like me, illegally viewing such things because I WILL NOT BE FORCED TO WAIT FOR THIS SHIT, the last liveblog of Doctor Who for quite some time is about to take place. And let us all enjoy the moment our heads collectively explode.
omg i love that i can say this: YOU ARE NOT PREPARED. Well, obviously, I am not either, BUT STILL.
No spoilery images or hints from me today. Let’s all respect that for each other, ok? Especially those in America who must wait a week.
This liveblog starts relative to you. So if it is airing on your television, start liveblogging away in the comments. Same for if you happen to be watching it online by less-than-legal means. (Though I would just time it with another time zone so you can comment with other people!) We already do this with Fringe and it works rather nicely. To avoid seeing spoilery comments regarding the episode from past livebloggers, I merely stay on the first page of comments and comment away, only going back after it’s over in order to comment on what other people said.
Sound fine? Just make sure not to post spoilers before this episode airs.
Have fun! This is my last real-time post before I leave for the AIDS/LifeCycle. Huzzah!
SEPTEMBER WHY YOU SO FAR AWAY?!
MIND
FUCKING
BLOWN.
THEORIES ABOUND
So if the astronaut girl is River/River is a Time Vortexed Human… River can't have been in the astronaut suit that killed the Doctor* because UM WOULDN'T SHE REMEMBER THAT.
She did say she was in prison for killing the best man she had ever known aka the Doctor.
Yeah but she would've known it was gonna happen and wouldn't have been surprised/tried to kill herself…
Unless she's a lot better actor than we think?
I think it's a stretch… she's never pretended to not know, she's just kept her mouth shut.
She pretended not to know Rory in the Big Bang? Word of God, that was her putting on an act instead of Rory's non-existence doing its work.
When Rory was busy not existing, what happened to River? Or was she immune because of Timelord?
Amy still existed even though her parents were taken by the crack, I assume the same rules applied!
Well Future!Rory was still waving from the hill in the Hungry Earth before the Crack ate him so it seems the universe knew it would all work out in the end.
She might not have been pretending. The Doctor knew Rory because he never forgot, Amy knew him because she forced herself to remember. It is possible that River was not able to remember Rorys existance at that moment in time
That's why I said Word of God- I thought the crack was the reason River didn't remember him, but Steven Moffat was asked why she seemed not to know him on twitter a while back, and he said she was pretending not to. Obviously either interpretation is valid, and what the Moff says only holds as much weight as you give it, but there you go.
Ohhhh gotchya. 😉 didnt realize you were talking about that deity.
Actually, she did, in TIA she tried shooting at the astronaut after the Doctor was shot and it didn't work, and she muttered something like "of course". If she's the astronaut then she couldn't shoot herself cos it's all paradoxy and stuff 🙂
I've always taken that to be sarcastic. "Oh, of course I can't take vengeance for the Doctor's life, FIGURES."
Would they imprison a (roughly) 6 year old?
well we dont know that shes six when she kills the doctor. they never showed the face of who killed him and then showed her as a child later. its totally a ploy to make us *think* it was the little girl when it wasnt.
Hmmmmm that's true <head explodes>
Even if she was 6 when she committed the crime, that doesn't mean she was that age by the time she was caught and charged.
But… who's gonna charge her for killing the Doctor? Does any government care that much? (ESPECIALLY the Church, as I assume that's who's imprisoned her. It looks like they kind of don't like him.)
Have we been told it's the doctor? maybe it was Rory…
Well, we're talking about whether she it's her in the suit. I don't think it's the Doctor she's killed, and tbh Rory sounds more likely to me…
Well people have said here that the church marines who try to kill the Doctor in this episode have the same uniforms as the group that try to help him in the Forest of Stone, so it sounds like they might have a change of heart.
I'm not convinced that the best man she's ever known won't turn out to be Rory.
I have a theory about River and her memories.
If Kovarian is training Baby!River to kill the Doctor, she’ll be the perfect weapon, not only because she has Time Lord DNA, but also because she’s the Pond’s daughter and as such, the Doctor just can’t up and kill her. He can’t kill his best friend’s daughter, because NO D:
The next best option for defeating/ stopping her? Wipe her memory of her childhood/ training. She only knows some things, like that being her first cradle, because the Doctor filled her in at a later point.
Though, that does bring up the point, if she was mind wiped before she killed the Doctor, why still go through with it? Then again, we still don't know the full story here and the Doctor's motivations etc.
Re-watch "The Impossible Astronaut." After she shoots at the astronaut and it doesn't work, she mutters under her breath "No, of course not."
I said above I read this as sarcastic; she tries to avenge the Doctor and it doesn't work. Harsh realities of the universe and such.
WHAT THE HELL!!!!
In a good way.
THIS WAS VERY CONFUSING BUT AT ALL TIMES AWESOME.
I actually like the Star Wars similarities! At least they decided to go for a full-on homage, and the ending was VERY Empire Strikes Back.
SO MANY FEELINGS.
AMY.
RORANICUS <3!
DOCTOR DOCTOR DOCTOR
RIIIIVEEEEER! omg the only water in the forest is the river MIND BLOWN.
This show.
AND THIS ALSO MEANS THAT RIVER IS A TIME LORD.
ERNKJL;ZRML;ADR NEVER EVEN THOUGHT OF THAT OH MY GOD FUCK YEAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
YOU KNOW WHAT THAT MEANS.
That means we could have MULTIPLE REGENERATIONS of her before we even get to the present one!!!
Scenes of Amy and Rory asking the Doctor if he's married to River or anything like that are going to be hilarious on rewatch. You're daughter and best friend are flirting 😀
I have a feeling Amy won't stand for that the next time she sees that happen.
And can you imagine Rory. It's going to be so funny.
Oh man, that scene where Rory goes to get her help and she says that there are two Doctors on another Birthday. I have a dirty mind, so I immediately assumed . . . something dirty. She's talking to her Dad about it?
Oh River, I love you.
<img src="http://i51.tinypic.com/34osg2c.gif" border="0" alt="Image and video hosting by TinyPic">
River Song: Trolling her parents about her sex life since before she was born.
On the flip side River's conversation with Rory in The Impossible Astronaut is extra sad since she was actually confessing her relationship problems and fears to her dad.
OMG! I didn't think about that. It's horrible. : ( Poor River.
Ow! Nice catch! Dad the legend, Dad, the last of his kind, Dad, the hero known as the Lone Centurion. Dad, the best man she's ever known?
Anybody else agree with me that the Doctor ruined River's life? She's spent years of her life in prison then died saving the Doctor?
I don't think that's the Doctor's fault; the blame belongs to Madame Kovorian and co. for creating a child to put in that situation in the first place. Just by the circumstances of her birth River's life is bound to be screwed up, especially in relation to her parents and the man she was born and raised to defeat.
Oh, shoot. BRILLIANT. YOU'RE RIGHT. AND ALL THIS … okay wait. This is going to be glossed over if I caps lock it even though I'm WAY STOKED.
All this time I was so convinced it was the Doctor, even though it was "too obvious". But at the same time, this WHOLE season they've been seeding the clues on how alike the Doctor and Rory are. With the whole "OMG does Amy love The Doctor" and whatnot.
So. To you, I salute.
Oh my god, words there are none! Rory is going to literally kill the Doctor for flirting and making out with his daughter. Oh god that is going to be an EXTREMELY awkward conversation.
I got told off by family for flailing during the episode D:
You know the more I learn about River the more I think her 'death' in Silence in the Library was…unsatisfying. What a crap ending for such a brilliant character.
Perhaps it will now be retconned?
Yeah, she can regenerate.
YES! I want a retcon cause then we get moar River.
We can only hope ;_;
Now I've calmed down, River = Melody makes all her off-screen 'dates' with the Doctor make a lot more sense. It's not the Doctor taking some girl out on a date, it's a fond… godfather? taking out his best friends' daughter for the day. D'AWWWWW
But they made out.
And that is exactly why I can't wait for Rory to find out. He has a sword, remember.
'sword' yeah okay…
Wait! What am I saying?!
Me and my mum had an hour long conversation last night about who River could be. My guesses were: she's either a future version of Amy or she's Amy's daughter. And i got Melody being part Time Lord right. I'm feeling quite proud of my brain right now, it's not so useless afterall! 😀
I'm going to be the party pooper here, but did anyone else think the River reveal was…underwhelming? Like, it was so obvious that she was their daughter that I expected it to be something bigger. Does anyone else agree? Or am I going to get hate for this?
I dunno, you never now with the Moff so I was more surprised that it was something obvious and not something like she was the Doctor in a future regeneration from 5000 years ago in an alternate universe.
As soon as the name was revealed it was pretty obvious. But this is a kid-friendly show, so… I'm sure they were freaking out.
Like, before the opening credits had even ended, Amy said 'Melody' and I went, 'oh, Melody Pond, River Song!', haha. And I hadn't been speculating online or anything. But then on Twitter a lot of people were genuinely massively surprised, and I think they moved fast enough that if you weren't sat on your sofa flailing like all of us most people wouldn't have seen it coming?
Tbh even though I guessed immediately, it was still SUPER-AWESOMELY-DONE, and I had to run into the kitchen and shriek a lot afterwards XD.
Practically irrevocable once she was all "yes.. we've met" to Rory early on.
Yep, I'm underwhelmed. And…. I DIDN'T like the "reveal." Maybe I'm just a traditionalist in regards to parent/child relationships and boundaries, but it seems like a very weird place to go. And as much as I love love love this show, my biggest anticipation for the fall is how Stephen Moffat is going to reconcile it. And I was also hoping that this episode would answer a lot of questions in more detail that have KIND OF been answered through inference and then use those those answers to raise new questions, but I just feel like we've been hanging on the same threads all season.
I don't know. I predicted it after The Impossible Astronaut and soon after that some little jerk spoiled people on fandomsecrets on lj and it was confirmed for me. I hoped it was going to be something else, just so it would turn out I hadn't been spoiled after all. Mostly I was happy about being right. lol
Arthur on Confidential talking about the twins playing Melody and being nervous handling them "It's ok, 'cos if we'd dropped one, there was a spare".
LOL ARTHUR IS MY BEST FRIEND FOREVER
Oh god Karen, Arthur and Matt interacting with the babies on Confidential. HOW DO THEY KEEP MANAGING TO FIND NEW LEVELS OF CUTE?!
The squee levels must be off the charts. Goddamn you family making miss Confidential.
BTW will anyone else be having nightmares forever because of baby Melody just.. collapsing into Flesh mush? ;____;
yes, that is a total nightmare.
Forced pregnancy followed by having the baby just… dissolve? AAAAAAUGH.
Especially once you think the baby is safe and you'll be going home soon AUGH
It was truly horrifying.
It IS the kind of horrible nightmare you tend to have when under the influence of pregnancy/post-birth hormones D:
Speaking of which, Amy was nowhere near hormonal enough in this episode.
But didn't they say at one point it was a month later? When Eyepatch was talking to someone, saying it had been a whole month without word from the Doctor. Would Amy's hormones have calmed down in a month? (I've never been preggo, I don't know)
As someone who is a mother herself, I'm still hormonal…and my baby's nearly 2! 😉
No, but seriously, I was freaking devastated when Melody dissolved. Genuinely, utterly horrified.
But was it forced pregnancy? I got the impression that baby Melody was generated in the usual fashion (and that she was conceived in…bunkbeds). It's just that Amy's been kept prisoner for her pregnancy,
It was a forced gestation. Amy was unaware that she was pregnant, and therefore unable to make the choice about whether she wanted to carry the pregnancy to term. And while for the story's sake, she clearly needed to, it still bumps into issues of choice.
But look at Amy when she first thinks she's pregnant. It doesn't seem like, in Amy's situation, abortion is something she'd even consider. It's a very real thing that comes up in very real circumstances, but with a majority of pregnancies no one even considers aborting it, because the circumstances don't call for it to be taken into consideration.
(If they had unprotected sex, that's kind of her decision right there…)
Wait, how was the pregnancy forced? Unaware, yes, but it's not like they impregnated her against her will (*shudder*)…
I think all the Whovians have crashed iPlayer :')
:O Definitely!
"Well they don't tend to put out balloons!" Oh, Doctor <3
I felt like those 45 minutes went by way too fast. They packed rather a lot of plot into this one, and less story. But that's a good thing, in a way, I think. I'm looking forward to the next half of the series, but there was enough in that to keep me busy until September, and I'm not OMG DESPARATE like I was at the end of the last episode.
Also, doctor squeeing over River's true identity at the end = cutest thing EVER.
Right, now that I've calmed down…
I really liked the ep – I was nervous every second of it, I was biting my nails, I literally did not take my eyes off the screen. Rory was brilliant, every side character was awesome (I'm surprised that I really enjoyed the Silurian Jack the Ripper Killer – and her maid – and the Sontaran) and the whole atmosphere was very Star-Wars (always good).
But, dammit, I think the whole River revelation was really overhyped for me. For a second there I thought she was going to reveal that she was the Twelfth (or older!) Doctor (my mind is WEIRD) and I was ridiculously excited and then…ARGH, I don't want to feel let down but I do. Maybe I'll change my mind on rewatch? Here's hoping.
When she showed him the name on the cot I thought maybe she was his original Gallifreyan wife, because I figured if he'd bothered to write the Pondbaby's name on it he could have painted it up nicely too, but, I just really didn't want her to be Pondbaby.
ME EITHER THANK YOU.
But after the Doctor's Wife, I wonder if the TARDIS has a special storage compartment that can't be deleted, because how else would he have been able to hold onto his ORIGINAL FREAKING CRADLE for 900+ years? But the fact that he's held on to it is super cute. And the fact that he keeps dodging around the fact that he's been a parent makes me wonder if it's going to be a plot point.
I am still dreaming of the return of Jenny. (when I saw the name in the character list on IMDb i got real excited but I was sadly disappointed)
My Significant Other somehow missed the Doctor's "but we… *makes kissy faces*" (I guess my SO also forgot the Day of the Moon flirting/make out????) and thought River's *wink wink* about the cradle was implying she was the Doctor's mom (!), until I pointed out how that's WAY HORRIFYING, especially for a show children watch!
So fucking creepy! *shudders*
http://youtu.be/erH-6vd8C5o
Very creepy.
(It's a teaser for the next episode/second half of the series for those wondering)
*FLAIL* OMG WHAT WHY WHAT?!
No seriously, can it just be Autumn? I will happily skip my birthday in August if it means getting to the second half of this series faster.
WHAT?
WHAT.
WHAAAAAT?
/Ten Voice
Bah. They've already killed the Doctor once this season. From the episode title I'm suspecting that Moffat is going to toy the hell out of the whole idea of going back in time to prevent various events from happening, and the Doctor will probably keep dying, but then they'll reset everything and it'll be fine.
OR we'll get the reason behind the Doctor inviting everyone to watch him get killed.
I feel like this should be marked as a Spoiler, because some people don't watch the trailers…
Creepy, and yet…
…part of me is kind've appreciating that shot, what is my brain.
Okay, i'm calling it now…….River Song is Susan's grandmother.
But shouldn't the Doctor remember River then?
This is the Moff we're talking about, he could pull some wibbley wobbley timey wimey shit and have the Doctor and River having a baby in the future, then that baby grows up and has a baby of their own, and the Doctor would have to send his granddaughter back to the first Doctor because if he didn't it would create a paradox and those flying beasties from Fathers Day would turn up and try to sterilise the universe. Or something……..
But what if Susan said, "I'm your grandaughter, but I can't tell you who my mum is because of ~spoilers~."
And so, a grand family tradition is born out of a time loop.
Oh my god I would LOVE to see a small child say "spoilers" in a sassy voice. I don't know why that popped into my brain, but PLEASE MOFF MAKE IT HAPPEN.
There was a really funny interview between Craig Ferguson and Alex Kingston back in January where she was like, "River's got this special word, and she just says "spoilers", like it was this original catchphrase. And he just looked at her, and said, "You know that's from the internet, right?"
Fave episode of S6 so far.Oh my god. IRL clutching at my head and going "MY … MY BRAIN" awesome.
Silurian lesbians and blubbery babydaddy Rory and River OMG slkjsfjlkafsdkjl;adfd. Love you forever, Show.
VICTORIAN MENSWEAR ON A WOMAN.
I daydream about that on a regular basis. Thank you for that, Moffat/DW costume designer.
OMG.
I NOW WANT RORY TO GIVE THE DOCTOR THE SHOTGUN TALK.
'you can time-travel all you want. I'm patient. and I have a sword"
I want the whole "what are you intentions towards my daughter" speech.
I just read that in Rory's voice and killed myself laughing.
Random questions which are only occurring to me now.
Why is Rory dressed as the Centurion again?
Why does the doctor have his old cot? Didn't he steal the TARDIS as an adult? I doubt he popped home to visit his mum and collect the family heirlooms :/
Because Rory looks really cute as a Centurion? Um.
Yeah I think that's why it only just occured to me XD too busy thinking "Yay Roranicus!"
Because he probably wore it just prior to his daugther's conception?
I figure its simply because a Roman Centurion is more legendary and fear/awe inspiring than plain Rory who we know is awesome, but other people wouldnt… and he has a sword.
and i think he totally could have gotten some stuff from home. the TARDIS is his new home so he moved all his stuff out of his old home, took his crib in case he runs into a space baby. i dunno lol
He probably had it lying around from when Susan was a baby or something
Why is Rory dressed as the Centurion again?
Glorious Fanservice
Why does the doctor have his old cot? Didn't he steal the TARDIS as an adult? I doubt he popped home to visit his mum and collect the family heirlooms :/
Well he was an adult but we know that he got married and had children before the Time War and he probably did that after he got the Tardis. He may have gone to see the universe but he could have gotten married during that time and the spouse probably traveled with him and the children lived in the Tardis. When you have a child you usually tell the grandparents so i guess his mother gave the cot to him as a gift for becoming a father.
That makes sense. I need to look up more backstory I think 😛
I just noticed it cause I've been expecting the Doctor to talk about the kids he had since it has mentioned Amy was pregnant. Now that cot's come up it should be addressed in some future episode, horray!.
Also bear in mind that, when he wants to, he can call upon his memories as Auton-Rory, which will include training and experience in close-quarters combat tailored to the weapons and armour of a Roman centurion.
And armor is just plain handy if you're confronting enemies. Maybe not as protective as dwarf star alloy or whatever, but if you've got spare armor, hey! why not protect yourself while looking AWESOME.
my question: Cybermen??
were they ever explained?
WHY WERE THE CYBERMEN THERE?!
Cos they're creepers who watch everything, so they'd know where Rory and the Doctor needed to go.
Directions! They were the TARDIS' SatNav.
Yeah and why for only 15 seconds or so?
And what was ganger-doctor saying last ep about cybermen? Cybermats? Whaa?
Because Moffat wants to one-up himself and see how many creatures/monsters he can cram into one episode.
Because the Doctor and Rory needed to find Demon's Run and the Cybermen had the intelligence.
The Doctor told him too, and I think it was to draw out his intrinsic "I AM A BADASS PROTECTOR, FUCK THE UNIVERSE I'M SAVING AMY" attitude.
Which it did. Oh, it did.
oooooooooomg
Hang on….
so does that mean….
Rose is the Bad Wolf???
Rory you are cool, don’t worry about it. The only thing not cool was your last name, which has been taken care of, just accept it.
Also River/Melody Pond *mind explodes*
My thoughts:
*hand wave* This is not the franchise you are looking for
Oh it looks like Metal Gear
The lady soldier is affected by the baaby and then she is sewing.. OK? :/
OK, we get it, the Victorian females are DOING IT
Ughhhh nuuuuuu I am so not on board with that. I unguessed that ON PURPOSE because I DISAGREE
I like how River calls him pet names.
Amy is kidnapped. Doctor finds her and scares away enemies with boring ease. People stand around and talk. It is revealed that River Song is exactly who everybody thought she was and the Ganger trick from last week is used again.
Even if this hadn't been billed as a huge, game-changing finale, I'd be disappointed. If this was just a regular episode with one on its way next week I'd be disappointed because this is just poor, lazy writing. There's a fine line between 'mysteries' and drama that is simply unsatisfying and this is just unsatisfying. I'm genuinely gutted.
Just starting my rewatch. when we think she's talking about the doctor and then it's rory, she says "he's the last of his kind"…. um? is he? the last roman? he isn't plastic anymore, so he isn't the last auton?
It's in his name, 'The Last Centurion'.
oh of course! hahaha! cheers! my mind has obviously been destroyed by this episode. I spent several minutes thinking "okay, melody pond is river song, and the gamma forest people changed pond to river because 'the only water in the forest is the river'… but where did they get SONG from?!?!" before getting it!
If River's a timelord, why didn't she regenerate back in the Library? Huh? Huh? Answer that Moffat!
Maybe she did. Or maybe her regeneration was turned off. Or maybe she was too badly physically damaged to regenerate. Or, or, or or…
The doctor wouldn't have regenerated either, though, would he? Isn't that why she stepped in, because she said if he died right then, her & him would never have happened.
FleshRiver? The River we know is on her last regeneration? Part of a master plan?
Infinite irritating possibilities. :3
She told him that it would destroy both his hearts and he wouldn't be able to regenerate from that. Presumably, neither would she!
River took his place because she knew the Doctor would die full-stop. So if it could've killed the Doctor, it'd kill any Time Lord.
I thought the whole point was that it basically burned her out? So she wouldn't have time to do whatever they need to do to regenerate.
Oh, and: "Mrs Williams" – guess he's not Rory Pond, then?
Amy put him in his place. "Melody Williams is a geography teacher, Melody Pond is a super hero." He's Rory Pond no matter what he thinks.
I like that Melody Pond IS a super hero, basically! River Song is a BAMF!
It's still more of an official "no, she took HIS name" than ideal though, huh?
Actually I lol'd at the super hero thing, what with the baby in a pod in space/embroidered MEANINGFUL EMBLEM inside baby's cot thing.
River Kent, also known as SUPERSONG
Mild mannered archeologist by day, super hero by night!
I didn't really take it as being official at all, just something Rory wanted to say. After all, the TARDIS and anybody who talks to her still registers Amy's name as "Amelia Pond" (that full-body scan certainly didn't think she was a Williams :D).
ARGH MY "TOTALLY LEGAL" DOWNLOAD WON'T SYNCH UP! The audio is a good 30 seconds behind the video! I DON'T KNOW IF I CAN WATCH LIKE THIS, YOU GUYS.
Import it into a video editing program and fix it.
If it's the one I'm thinking of, it syncs up after the credits.
It did, thank you!
Reddit?
That seems to be the only *totally* legal version of it I can find on line.
Dont worry though. It synches up at about the minute mark. Shortly after the opening credits.
A proper, synced version is now available, also – it says "proper" in the file name.
"I'd say she's human, going by the life support software"
"And incredibly strong- she must have torn her way out"
River… talking about…. herself? presumably? I've just been assuming girl in astronaut suit is melody/river/amy's baby/ regenerating girl… but adult river can't seem to remember it. So, where have I gone wrong in the line of logic? halllllp!
That's a good point. River should have known who the girl was straight away if it was herself. So maybe the girl isn't River?
Maybe because the Silents seem to have had her at the time, she can't remember because they were all over the place?
I have no idea!
oh, like the guy in the orphanage hasn't realised two years had passed- so she just kept forgetting!
Well she couldn't tell them it was her or else it fucks up the order of events. The doctor wasn't meant to know that until demon's run which had already happened from river's point of view. So she may have acted like she didn't know to avoid even hinting at "spoilers."
Ssssspoilers!
OH MY GOD
*did not even think of that*
She only died there because the Doctor was planning on connecting the electric things and she said that "even you wouldn't survive that" so she definitely died in the library. Didn't she get completely incinerated by the voltage as well?
Rewatching, there's some comedy gold when he realises who River is, says "but you and me…" (makes slightly smoochy kissy noise), River agrees, the Doctor looks back at the unknowing parents, squees a bit and runs like Hell!
Yes, you really don't want to explain to the inlaws,do you Doctor?
YES! I was JUST watching that bit and it's like he was a naughty child being caught snogging his girlfriend by their parents! oh, doctor!
The Doctor-River Song relationship has suddenly become so creepy.
Why creepy?
It's creepy because he's known her since she was a baby. Now it falls into the grooming a child for a future sexual relationship territory. I hate to compare Doctor Who to Twilight but if you found the Jacob resolution gross, you have to find this gross.
I hope that Doctor Who will find a better explanation to reduce the squick.
Though, we don't actually know how much time the Doctor is going to spend with River through her babyhood and childhood. It might not be very much at all.
It does still come off and sort of creepy, however.
The thing with canon, though, is that it's only creepy in retcon. Because Stephen Moffat came up with the River/Doctor relationship before the idea that she'd be Amy and Rory's daughter, and hell, before Amy and Rory were even created.
But yes, now that it IS a big creepy, I'm really hoping it's well-resolved in the fall. I'm all for cliffhangers, but things that make me morally uncomfortable, I kinda like those ironed out earlier.
She has also been making fun of his bowtie since she was a baby so i think it might be able to even out a bit (though i do admit it is a bit creepy.)
NGL, I burst out laughing when I saw 'grooming a child for future sexual relationship' because no, seriously.
My God, the Doctor is Jacob Black.
WHATTTTTTT.
How is he 'grooming a child for a future sexual relationship'? Or anything like it? He hasn't (at this point) known her since she was a baby, though she has known him since she was a baby. From his point of view he's just met an adult he likes and has chemistry with, the same as anyone else. I guess their relationship might change in the future as he reacts to the knowledge of who she is, especially if he spends a lot of time with baby River/Melody (which he presumably does, I'm guessing he taught her to fly the TARDIS etc). If it then continues to be flirty and kissy then yes, it might get weird. As it stands at the moment I really don't see what the problem is. The similarities between this and the Jacob thing are pretty much non-existent once you get beyond the surface.
I've been reading Mark Reads/Watches for quite some time now and have never felt compelled to comment before. But the idea of the Doctor & River somehow falling into the category of 'grooming' was so unexpected I just had to say something.
First of all, welcome to the commentariat (or whatever)!
Secondly, I also doubt that the Doctor was grooming child-River, Breaking Dawn creeper-style. We have no idea when River next sees the Doctor in her timeline after meeting him in infancy, which she probably doesn't remember. Their next meeting might be when the astronaut shoots the Doctor in Utah, if that was indeed River. Since their timelines are at least somewhat reversed, it could be possible that each party's entrance into the romantic aspect of the relationship was in relative ignorance as per their own timeline, with the more knowledgeable partner unable to stop it without creating a paradox… Are my words making sense?
Even if they do, that's still totally fucked up.
You're making total sense. At least I think so! It's so hard to talk about the timey-wimey stuff. Even when it makes sense in your head, explaining what you mean is a whole different matter.
And yes, it's totally fucked up. But to me, it's fucked up in a mind-bending weird way, not a creepy way. It's a long way from that to grooming.
Agreed. When the Doctor met River, she was just a sassy archaeologist who seemed to know all about him and knew his name. And then she died. Which was intriguing and scary and weird all at once. We don't know when she met him, but it sounded like she was probably Amy's age when he… what? Ran into her on one of his random adventures? We don't know.
Now, starting to fall in love with someone and then finding out that someone is your best friends' child that just got kidnapped is definitely weird. But I actually think it will be much more awkward for Rory and Amy, who just had a kid and have to reconcile that baby with the adult they've known for some time than for the Doctor, who seems to be used to his life making no sense.
Either way, it's still less creepy than the book the Time Traveller's Wife, which I found really irritating.
This.
And I can't see the Doctor grooming anyone for anything sexual, the dude doesn't even know what to do with his hands when he's being kissed. Sex appears to be this thing that comes up now and then with the people around him and fills him with little boy 'ew gross' awkwardness. Guy needed prompting to figure out what his two newly wed companions might be doing on their wedding night.
That he apparently ends up being in love with River and happens to know her as a baby too is just kind've…it's the Doctor. He tends to know an awful lot of people at different stages of their lives. He knew Amy as a little girl too, and she just had a baby herself.
Plus, there's no Imprinting. Ignoring that seems to be ignoring the squickiest part of the whole Jacob Black thing, seeing as neither party in that case had any say in the super ultra powerful magical attraction, ugh.
No. Nothing like Jacob/Renesmee. Trust me, I find that story horrible, and this isn't like that at all.
We have to assume The Doctor doesn't interact with Melody at allll until much later than the events in TIA/DotM. She's being used as a weapon/on her own probably at least until adolescence, and then The Doctor probably only has occassional aromantic/asexual chance encounters with her until adulthood. Hardly ~grooming~.
Compared to Jacob who considers literally the entire world to be about Renesmee and spends every single moment of the rest of his existence around her, and breast(blood)feeds her when she's a baby. (Seriously. He lets her feed on him as a child in a really breastfeeding-like manner.)
The only thing in common is that Doctor saw Melody as a baby. For about 2 minutes. In flesh form.
I just had to beat up my desk at that reveal. River Song = Melody Pond = I MUST HIT MY DESK A FEW TIMES AS I FLAIL.
I guess it's because I thought the theory was kind of cracky? I don't know, I definitely didn't expect it to actually be TRUE. I can't decide how I feel about this. SOMEONE TELL ME HOW TO FEEL ABOUT THIS.
IN THE MEANTIME, AKJAJSHBDIUAJKHB SKJADHFC KJSAHGFOIAUD<MHBS DAKJFLSAKJDHFlkasjdfkl jbsakjf jsdlkjfhgsakdjfosiyhertf jsabxdc,.masndkfjyhasdluyasiudghflkas jdhf.
You feel Hurt. Confused. A little dirty.
(/Gilmore Girls reference)
I did not want Amy's baby to be River because it felt way too soap opera-y and, given River's relationship with the Doctor, CREEPY.
I am not sure how I feel, but this emoticon covers most of it: D8
yeah, i also felt like it was a creepy reveal. what is with the moff turning our doctor into a pervy weirdo creep? i was bothered enough by the surreptitious monitoring of amy's body, now it turns out he's dating her daughter? ugh.
though i have to say, i was a bit thrown by all the speculation around the crib, and river's interest in it, and had this moment where it all felt very star wars/incest-y, so i was mostly just relieved that river wasn't revealed as his mother or sister or something… ugh.
c'mon moff. you can do better!
I like that twist! Since I'd never heard that theory before it caught me completely off guard and I had this huge chill go up my back during the reveal. It makes perfect sense. And look on the bright side! This could have been way creepier if some of the earlier episodes had been written carelessly.
MAN, FOR REAL.
YES PLEASE VICTORIAN SILURIAN NINJA LESBIANS FOREVER
I feel like I would be more impressed if that theory hadn't been passed around since the first episode of the season. Still, I think this opens up more questions than it answers. I wonder if the Moff had this planned since season 4….
O.M.G. VICTORIAN SILURIAN NINJA LESBIANS ARE THE BEST MINOR CHARACTERS EVER CREATED. I WANT BACKSTORY, AND I WANT IT NOW.
Also, WTAF IS THAT UPCOMING EPISODE TITLE. SERIOUSLY. NOW I HAVE RORY AS AVPM!RON IN MY HEAD SCREAMING "LET'S GO KILL HITLER!!11!!!1"
River told the Doctor she was "quite the screamer" in front of Amy and Rory. That's all I need to say here.
Well, she was crying when they took her in the TARDIS for the first time. So it's not like they'd never find out, right?
>_>
UGH, this is why it's so creepy! Baby screams, orgasmic screams – presumably the Doctor's heard it all? ): D: D8
He's her forever-lover!
But hey, even wise-man warriors can have kinks. Age-play probably IS a big thing for him, being the last Immortal (he has inside him blood of kiiiings). With her it's in-built! OTP!!!
You just made things worse, not better! I'm just gonna make this face some more: D8
Heehee!
Oh, I'm turrubul. Sorry! :3
In retrospect, that probably meant she was a baby. Major hint-hint.
I always thought it was hanging a lampshade on the whole "Who companions are screamy dramatic wimminz" trope.
This episode shows the church from the Angels two parter in a whole new light doesn't it? Wish Father Octavian hadn't died, he wouldn't have stood for all this baby kidnapping/working with super weird monks horseshit.
Anyone else really hate the whole "we're doing this incredibly evil thing because sometimes you're kind of scary when people do something evil and you have to stop them" rationalisation that villains use against heroes? I get that villains are usually hypocrites and you're supposed to hate them and their reasoning but this one just drives me up the wall, especially when the protagonists go "OMG he or she is totally right" and start distrusting their own instincts or whatever. Amanda Waller does this alot in the DC comics and despite being proven wrong every time she goes right back to distrusting heroes motives and hiring killers to mess with them.
Oh god, Father Octavian! I miss you!
(but at least his church wasn't teaming up with the headless monks… except, the doctor found the homing box with Rivers message on in the museum inside 'the final resting place of the headless monks'… so, the byzantium crash and father octavian DID have something to do with the headless monks? except if it was their final resting place then father octavian probably knew how they were defeated? maybe? Oh I don't know! I just miss father octavian!)
asfsdfsdff I have wondered about that headless monks line for EVER and I didn't even make the connection and afsfsf
So… Does that mean the Byzantium crashed on Demon's Run or do the monks have another hangout still?
Oh, and did anyone else think the whole 'Colonel Runaway' speech was FREAKING BADASS??
SO TRUE.
Thoughts:
So, the theory everyone was throwing around all season turned out to be true… I guess I'm okay with that? I mean, it does make TARDIS relations 200% more awkward (timey wimey!) but on the other hand I guess it's kind of awesome to know that your kid is going to grow up to be a complete badass? Whatever, you know the TARDIS is laughing herself sick over the paradoxes. Also, Amy, A+on your child naming skills, you're right, 'Melody Pond' IS a superhero.
I think the pacing was kind of weird on this but I kind of don't care because the first half of the episode was fantastic. GO GO TARDIS ARMY. SPACE PIRATES.
I need to see more of Silurian lady being badass in 19th century London. Srsly.
I don't know what else to say except I suspect everything is going to get weirder from here on out.
I know people were disappointed with the expectedness of the supersecret plot twist… but to be honest, I watched with my family, who should know better, and they were completely dumbstruck. Dad guessed that River was the Doctor's mother, my sister that she was his child. I was all "Do you seriously not get it??" but they really didn't. So yeah, I can completely see how in other circles it WAS as unexpected plot twist.
"I think the pacing was kind of weird on this but I kind of don't care because the first half of the episode was fantastic. GO GO TARDIS ARMY. SPACE PIRATES. "
My Dad said "Huge jigsaw puzzle. And I don't even have all the edges." One of the best descriptions of Who ever?
My Dad said "Huge jigsaw puzzle. And I don't even have all the edges." One of the best descriptions of Who ever?
Yes.
It was very Star Wars, wasn't it?
I really enjoyed it but after Moffat said how we would see the Doctor at his most angry I was expecting some Time Lord Victorious action.
TOTALLY. It's like Moffat taking all these seemingly unrelated things and combining them into something ABSOLUTELY BADASS. XD
Fuck Torchwood. I want "The Adventures Of Badass Lesbian Silurian Crime Fighter In Victorian London".
My thoughts:
1) There must be a new Trock band created and their name must be Rory and the Space Pirates
2) River Song being Amy and Rory's daughter?? OMG BEST THING EVER MUST REWATCH ALL PREVIOUS RIVER EPISODES TO PICK UP ON THE HINTS!
3) Generally the pacing was kind of weird this episode – loads of things being brought together which were kind of irrelevant and just made me want loads of backstory for the nurse Sontaran and the crime-solving kick-ass Silurian in the Victorian age with her epic lesbian lover (<3 BEST EVER), it was all really just a build-up to the end. Like it felt ridiculous when everything was wrapped up and okay and then that god-awful reveal when Melody was Flesh and then they had that fight and oh god my HEART and then all the tricksy reveals and thinking River was the Doctor's mum and then OH GOD NO SHE'S THEIR DAUGHTER, THE DOCTOR'S BEEN GETTING OFF WITH RORY AND AMY'S DAUGHTER LOL FOREVER LOVE THAT HE RAN OFF LIKE A NAUGHTY KID AFTER REALISING THAT
SO BASICALLY. It wasn't a perfect episode, it had quite a lot of flaws in pacing and general consistency, and some of the dialogue/acting was abysmal (oh god the gay Anglicans were amazing but SUCH POOR ACTORS and that Silurian line of 'I don't know, but she was very brave' sounded like it was being delivered to a six year old) but the reveals were FABULOUS because I didn't see them coming and now cannot wait until Autumn and finding out how all the shit goes down!
Also oh god I really hope that the Doctor brought Amy and Rory to Darillium so they could say bye to their daughter too :'(
OMG… the logo, guys! The stylized Greek letter omega, which was the logo of the base at Demon's Run, and also on the uniforms of the army clerics in TTOA/FAS.
Omega technically created the Time Lords.
These people wanted to create their own Time Lord.
…
Mind = BLOWN.
…
HOLY SHIT
…………
BRB MUST GO COLLECT EXPLODED HEAD.
I SAW THAT! (the logo and that it was the same, not the rest of the mind-blowy stuff you just pointed out)
BRB, MIND BLOWN FOREVER.
River was wearing that patch in her first appearance I think, if not then definately at the crash of the Byzantium.
River was wearing Cleric BDUs at the crash of the Byzantium, presumably as an alternative to her prison uniform, hence the logo of the Anglican Marines or whatever that omega is.
Was anybody else expecting a "your going to be the godfather" scene with the doctor?
OTHER QUESTIONS:
-Who the hell is eyepatch lady and what does she have against the Doctor? What motivated her to set up this ridiculous Xanatos Gambit of stealing the Pondbaby and turning it into a weapon to fight the Doctor, and possibly sending the Silence after him as well/exploding the TARDIS?
-How does River Song, someone apparently raised to kill the Doctor, fall in love with him and become someone he trusts enough to tell his actual name?
THEORIES ABOUND
-Assuming it IS River who shot the Doctor in Episode 1 (because it seems exceedingly likely), just how is that all part of the plan? I'm assuming it's part of SOME plan on the Doctor and/or River's part.
Actually… I don't think it's at all impossible that the Doctor we saw die was Flesh, given how important it's proving to be to the story so far. And now that the Doctor knows he has to die at that time and place, he could easily set it up. So then the question becomes: what was the real Doctor doing while his (probable) duplicate was getting killed?
WTF MOFFAT WHAT IS YOUR PLOTTING.
Theories Abound
Eyepatch lady seems to me to be someone from the church (very militant/powerful organisation) whos grown up with these stories of the Doctor and thinks "holy shit he sounds dangerous and threatening to my/our power base if we piss him off with all this universe dominating stuff we so clearly want to start doing". So she decides to go on the offensive. I'm wondering if we might get a multi series plot thread, showing all the shady human empire stuff that's been going on in the background of the Doctors adventures that he's always been too busy to properly investigate, stuff like the "empire" thats willing to do dangerous mining on a planet orbiting a black hole or the Ood/flesh abuses and how it's all lead to this powerful empire thats managed to get away with horrendous stuff over a large period of time just because the Doctors attention was elsewhere and now they're scared he's going to realise somethings up and call them on it.
I've just realised, River popped along for her parent's wedding! 🙂
And asked the Doctor if he danced at her parents' wedding too. <3
OMG, THAT'S HOW RIVER KNEW THE DOCTOR'S NAME! SHE READ IT ON HIS COT!!!!!
AHHHHHH!!!! *flails*
YOU ARE MORE BRILLIANT THAN THE ENGLISH LANGUAGE HAS YET FIGURED OUT HOW TO EXPRESS
SO TRUE. OMG. Maybe only those with TimeLord blood can read Gallifreyan?
Howeeeeeevaaaaahh, there's till that line that ten said when River had handcuffed him before she sacrificed herself (for lack of a better word) that was something like, "You knew my real name. There's only one time I'd ever…. only one time I could…" which makes me think either wedding or sexytimes.
Yeah, but that's because Ten believed that he would have to have TOLD HER. But actually, he didn't NEED TO, because she read it on his cot.
I don't think she did, but there's no evidence to either argument. You're wildly theorizing – fun, but not credible.
Really? I think it's highly credible. The Doctor's said it's his cot and it's not a stretch to think it might have his name on it. True, it might say something entirely different, or maybe River can't read it at all, but it's hardly 'wildly theorizing' with 'no evidence'.
She has left him messages before in High Gallifreyan. I think logic is on the side of her reading it there.
And there were a lot of lingering, close-up shots on the Gallifreyan words during that scene, which would be a waste of time if they didn't mean something.
And I from what I gathered, the Doctor knew who River was *because* she was able to read the side of the cot. He didn't know what the prayer thing was, so there wasn't any reason for him to think, "Ooh, that has River's first name on it! That must mean she's the baby!"
But since the TARDIS doesn't translate Gallifreyan, it's possible that the only reason she'd be able to read his name would be if she had Time Lord blood- which would be what tipped him off that she was Melody.
At least, that's how I read that scene.
Agree 100%!
OH MY GOD FUCKING DFNLZSDGTKFKEFKPRT MIND BLOWN FOREVER MOFFAT YOU ARE A FUCKING GENIUS
AFSDFSDFD EVERYTHING IS TRUE
Just realised River's comment at the beginning to Rory: "It's my birthday" = foreshadowing.
Yes, River, today is your actual birth day. Awesomeness.
This is driving me INSANE. For people in the states, where did you watch the episode? I cant find it anywhere.! Someone please help me 🙁
http://www.sockshare.com/file/04C7B76BB5FCFF64# (In case you haven't found it yet)
THEORIES ABOUND
On watching for the second time, I noticed a very definite nurse/warrior internal conflict theme.Of course there is River's speech about how the word "doctor" has changed meaning over the centuries, because the meaning of the word comes from the doctor himself (and just an aside, I LOVED that) – so is the doctor a healer/wiseman/caring (nurse) type character, or is he truly a warrior? Then on the second watch I noticed the sontaran who was punished by having to be a nurse, although his true nature is to be a warrior, when he dies, Rory says "No. You were a nurse." implying that he also had had some kind of internal conflict. And then finally there is Rory himself, who started off as a nurse, and the nurse aspects to his personality have been highlighted a few times this + last series, notably in The Doctor's Wife when he found it difficult to watch Idris die, but at other times as well. And yet he's dressed as a Roman soldier, more of a warrior type role.
Also, unrelated theory/musing, but I picked up both times that the doctor said to Lorna about them running, in the same tone of voice River used in the library. "Watch us run." And while I can believe that the doctor never forgets anyone, he seemed to be particularly sad about her. And "She was brave." "They're always brave." what was that about?? Especially considering Amy was telling Melody she would always be brave, at the start.
Future temporary companion. The companions are always brave.
Like someone just said a few posts down: "the only water in the forest", said by irdis to Rory…. and yeah….. I took that to mean something that comes to be in the series finale. Meaning they may be going to the gamma forest after all said and done? So yeah, may be meeting a younger version of her there.
Wibbly-wobbly timey wimey.
Also, now I think about it, Rory appears to be gathering one hell of a lot of information these days. He's…. well, good lad. But also I'm now worried =/
lol, im always worried about rory. Arent we all >,>
I also think the Sontaran nurse and the soldier who'd joined to meet the Doctor reinforced the themes of the episode. Look at what happens to nurses and little girls who the Doctor interacts with, Lorna and Amy. The Sontaran and Rory. Coin flips, companions who never were but still chose to help the Doctor and his allies and they died because the Doctor was in their lives.
I'm still picking up the pieces of my brain off the floor.
WHY DO YOU DO THESE THINGS TO ME MOFFATT?
Oh my gosh, this means that Rory, Amy and River are the first actual family to have traveled with the Doctor!
As companions, not just for an episode.
I would watch the fuck out of that show, NGL.
I don't think you were experiencing a comprehension fail at all! In fact, that's exactly what I was thinking…there's always running when the Doctor shows up, so if you're the Doctor and you're trying to comfort a dying person and tell them you remember them, talking about the running is a pretty safe bet.
With the Gamma Forest I figured either that adventure is to come or River's name just came from the cloth, as River Song is simply the translation from the Gamma language. River sure did know a lot about the Gamma Forest, though (she also knew that Doctor meant Warrior there), so my money's on an upcoming adventure there.
Will River change her own future by letting the Doctor know where she was kept as a child?
Ah okay, maybe you two are right.
"… o if you're the Doctor and you're trying to comfort a dying person and tell them you remember them, talking about the running is a pretty safe bet. "
Also when The Doctor meets her in his future he can always make sure they run for any silly reason so she can remember it later.
I was so not prepared.
THE FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK!?
OH MY GOD
OH MY GOD
OH MY GOD
POOR AMY AND RORY
THEY NEVER GET TO RAISE THEIR CHILD
They still might. They just… already know the fruits of their labour? or something?
OMG this was my thought too SO SAD
but maybe they'll have another kid! or something.
I accidentally read spoilers while searching for a proper download so I was totally ruined.
In the rest of the season I want to see Amy and Rory scold River. Like for shooting guns and breaking out of jail and stuff. They really need to exercise their authority over her cuz it will make me lol.
Also I really hope they get to raise her in their time for a while. And even if they are not regulars in the future they can guest star, etc.
Also, in the first ep of this season, when River was all "One day, he won't know me at all, and it will kill me," she was talking to her father, Rory. Who doesn't know her at all at that point.
I knew it! I knew it! I knew it!!!!!
Anyone have a link? I've found one copy of it on Megavideo, but that refuses to work longer than five seconds.
http://fileserve.com/file/Uwzc9As/Doctor.Who.2005…
Here is a DL but if u want to stream instead here you go: http://watchseries.eu/episode/doctor_who_s6_e7-99…
Loombo links work pretty well for me. Also, the beginning has a audio/video lag on most of these, BUT ONLY until the credits so don't freak out like I did. It kept me from watching for hours until I heard that it worked after the credits.
It's just started and it jossed my favorite fan-theory: that River was Amy and Rory's kid from the future. ):
Cybermen? Really? At least they aren't alternate reality versions, I think.
Still, Melody, Song.
RORY YOU KICK SO MUCH ASS.
…did they just destroy a whole fleet of cybermen? wat
hey, the church army is back
Gamma Forest? Only water in the forest.
…silurian? sontaran? what is going on
Aww River Song's birthday.
…is River going to kill Rory? Is that the 'good man'?
so why do they need the baby?
"Can I borrow your gun" I love you, Amy.
… Papal mainframe? Deus ex machina?
DOCTOR!
AMELIA POND, GET YOUR COAT
I kind of love the silurian and her ninja maid.
are those the WWII space planes?
"I'm angry, that's new." lol, no it isn't
oh my goddd lovely heartbreaking touching moment why do I have the feeling that this is going to be ruined.
Eleven is like the ultimate cockblocker, isn't he
"Melody Pond is a superhero" awwwww
"Be aware I do have a sword"
well that is a nice explanation of how the time baby would have happened
…Lorna? I guess it isn't River, then.
There's River.
Doctor what the fuck is going on. Fuck I hate this unreveal. I WANT TO KNOW.
dajkfad OH MY GOD IT IS HER. OH MY GOD.
TEARS, STREAMING DOWN MY FACE.
So. My brain keeps telling me to get this out of my chest so I will.
FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU MOFFAT WHAT IS YOUR BRAIN.OMG
OK, then. Be prepared for a really long (and slightly non coherent) comment. Because thoughts. I has them. And I also have a list.
Well I'm a bit torn at the moment. I liked the episode. I really did. But for some reason I also didn't like it? IDEK. It's weird because it wasn't a bad episode per se, I don't think there has being a really bad episode on Eleven's run, and while I'm thankful for that, this one felt like a bit of a let down, specially after some rather brilliant episodes that we've seen so far (THE DOCTOR'S WIFE, THAT EPISODE WILL NEVER NOT BE AMAZING, OMG I SHOULD GO WATCH IT AGAIN). Thing is, this could've being a rather amazing episode, because it had everything you could've need to make one: awesome actors (Matt, Karen and Arthur being wonderful as they are, hell even Alex and we only saw her for like 2 and a half minutes. That's power acting for ya), awesome background characters, a good setting, a rather good script. And yet it felt a bit, I know know rushed? Oddly paced? Maybe it was because I've being waiting soooooo fucking much for this to happened that because it wasn't as I expected it, it feels kinda odd. Not bad, just odd. It was definitely better after the second watch (don't judge, I was confused and mind blown), but yet… Meh I'm not making any sense. Shutting up now. It's list time!
What I liked:
– The Doctor. There were a lot of good Doctor moments in this one. And I loved all of them. I love how he's just the Doctor and that because he's the Doctor he won't let anyone hurt his little Amelia and his Rory and their baby, because they're his best friends and they're don't deserve it andhe just won't allow it. I loved that he made an army on the most unimaginable people/aliens just to say the people he loves. I loved how he knows he's a BAMF and how he's not afraid to let others know. And I love how he's flail-y and awkward and weird and insane. And I loved how he gave the baby his cot (hell I loved that he KEPT his own cot). GAH I just love him. Matt's Doctor is becoming my favorite fast and I really don't mind (after all the Doctor is like chocolate, there is no bad flavor). Also, his SQUEE moment when he found out who River was. ILU DOCTOR.
– Rory. Fuck if there is a character in this series more than the Doctor that would probably be Rory. He's just wonderful. In every way. And I have nothing else to say. Also: HE'S A BADASS MOTHERFUCKER. THAT IS ALL.
– Rory/Amy: I've always find them adorable, but this episode just made me want to hug them and give them cookies and milk. They were really really really cute.
– The Silurian lady and her maid/lover: <3 <3 <3 <3 <3
– The Doctor running/escaping when he found out who River is (and the mental image I got of Rory threating the Doctor for corrupting his baby girl XD ) : It was just hilarious and the WTF JUST HAPPENED face Rory and Amy got when River told them she was their daughter was epic, I expect a lot of shenanigans coming from this four, DON'T LET ME DOWN MOFFAT (not that he ever has).
Things I didn't like as much:
– The pacing was extremely odd. I don't know what it is but it felt like it had a lot of things and not much reason for them. I mean it wasn't bad just… I don't know, weird.
– That's it? I actually thing a lot of the problems I have with the episode where that I made so much of a big deal of the premise of the it, that the episode itself, Eh it just sort of there. Especially after we've watched such a good episodes this series (OMG THE DOCTOR'S WIFE I WILL NEVER STOP FANGIRLING OVER IT. IT WAS JUST SOOOOO GREAT).
So yeah. That's all.
/cool story bro.
Rory has a sword, remember. I'd run too.
So on IMDB, they credited someone as being a Silent in the episode. Anyone catch where it was? Or have we all ~forgotten~?
Don't trust IMDB. A while back, they credited a character as being a young Lucy Saxon in this episode.
Also they say that the Ninja-Maid Jenny is the Doctors Daughter Jenny. (Why do you lie to me IMDb?)
That's an oddity of the database. Once you create a character profile for "Jenny" from Doctor Who all Jennies in Doctor Who get added to it. Jenny the maid from Human Nature is listed as well.
That actually would have been kind of awesome.
*badass blonde girl is badass*
Doctor: "Oh, hi! Just, when you grow up, promise not to marry any renegade Time Lords, hmm?"
You know, we don't really need an excuse to re-watch this episode anyway XD
I think IMDB info can be deceptive and probably "spoilery".
But next time I watch this episode I will keep a marker nearby.
I had to work today, when by the time I got home to watch the show, I was too nervous to even attempt to liveblog. God, I'm crying. I was right. I was joking with my theory. "haha, wouldn't this be funny!" But damn it! I was right. I'm never right when I try to figure out Doctor Who. Nothing with major things like this. But I was. I could kiss Steven Moffat right now. I was so afraid by the end of the episode I'd want to murder him, but I just want to kiss him. I honestly don't know what to do with myself now. The main goals of the day were work and watch Doctor Who. What do I do now?
Welp, now we know where River gets her BADASSNESS from.
Her Mother and Father.
That awkward moment when Moffat uses a fan theory from 1995….
http://bit.ly/kdq9DI
YOU GUYS SRSLY HOW DID ANYONE FIND THIS.
Fan theory? It's Moffat who posted it 🙂
Also, the first reply to his idea, 'If only the Doctor Who writing staff could be this imaginative'…oh, I bet they're laughing to themselves now.
It's from 1995 so at the time he was a fan… his OWN fan theory of course.
Good stuff.. I really like it… If only the Doctor Who writers could be
so imaginative…
Pat
BRB LOLING FOREVER
Uhhhhhhh anglocentric much :<
Yeaaaah tbh I looked at his profile and there's an archive of a lot of his posts in discussions and, eesh.
But I mainly posted cos he gets to write his own fanfiction and it's canon.
Ohhhh, Moffat. You great big geek.
omgomgstartingomgomgomg
Did anyone else notice that Rory has a sonic screwdriver now?
No – where did you see that???
First with the Cyber-ship, you can see him sonicking a door (At least, I assume it's him). And then when he reunites with Amy, you can hear him sonicking the door open (Though I suppose the second time could be the Doctor, despite the fact he doesn't actually show up for a few minutes).
Oh, I do remember the 2nd one – I just figured he borrowed the Doctor's sonic. It would be cool if he had earned his own, though 🙂 Good catch!
Or it could be the numbers game again, in The Almost People I still can't work out the number of screwdrivers!
AAAAH didn't expect them so soon
Oh, and they're already running into trouble. >:D
…what. Oh. Oh! Oh, man. Amy tells the BEST BEDTIME STORIES.
hoshit
HOSHIT okay wow.
And opening credits!
Whoa. Nice scanner, weird army guys.
They're practicing…!? Whoa. These guys are PREPARED. And yet, never prepared.
ROFLFOFLOFLOFL
Say no say no say no say no DAMMIT
Wait, what? Who? When? XD
Oh hohohohoho. Getting the band back together. >:D
BEST. NURSE. EVER.
Oh she's so young. 🙁
Usually the Doctor runs away. Rarely he runs towards, and when he does his enemies cannot run away fast enough.
Huh. I'm…not quite sure what to make of that. While on one hand, there were many exciting pieces, I felt like it was just a bit…off? Like at the beginning, where they brought together so many of the side characters to help the doctor, there were so many and they weren't really fleshed out so it felt like a cheap shot to get us to be excited for this OHSOEXCITING episode. Also, not really sure how I feel about the River reveal. I'll have to see how this plays out. On the other hand, Amy and Rory with a baby! So cute! And the baby being a ganger totally took me by surprise–I'll admit, when Eyepatch Lady said she had fooled the doctor with the same trick, for a second I thought that it was AMY who was a ganger again. Hmm…perhaps, since this season has been so fantastic, my expectations were just too high. Interesting. I'll have to rewatch it to see if I like it any better, now that I know what to expect.
I also thought it was Amy who was a ganger again. I was watching it thinking, 'but how does that help the bad guys? If Amy melts they still won't have the baby.' My brain somehow didn't make the leap from that to Melody being the Ganger. It made the moment when Melody MELTED IN AMY'S ARMS OMG all the more horrifying. Like it needed to be more horrifying.
Ahhhh hooray! Surprise!
BEST. ENTRANCE. EVER. Except maybe the one time that- no! BEST EVER.
I was flailing and squeeing from the very beginning.
RORY. I DIDN'T THINK ONE BODY COULD CONTAIN THAT MUCH BADASSERY.
Ooooh misdirection.
Oh that's why. o_O
RIVER IS AMY AND RORY'S DAUGHTER
RIVER IS AT LEAST PARTIALLY TIME LORD
RIVER IS A BAMF
RIVER JUST BROKE MY DOCTOR/SEXY OTP
My OT3 was River/Doctor/TARDIS but given the TARDIS's role in River's conception… um, ew.
This occurred to me as I was trying to sleep last night. It's just not fair. 🙁 🙁 🙁
Oh no.
I just had a thought even worse than that one.
River is sort of the TARDIS's daughter.
The Doctor is sort of married to the TARDIS.
So… the Doctor is sort of River's step-father.
yeah, there are just all sorts of weird feelings about this development…
MELODY POND.
RIVER SONG.
RIVER, POND, MELODY, SONG.
HHHHHMMMMMMMM.
HAHAHAHA yeah that worked.
Wow. Okay, never ever ever piss off the Doctor.
Roranicus Williamicus! 😀
…huh. This is way too early for a full resolution…
What. What? WHAT?!